.svg)
.png)
Show Notes
#303 Storytelling | This episode is from Drive 2025, our 2-day in-person event for B2B marketers in Burlington, VT. Harry Dry, creator of Marketing Examples and one of the best copywriters on the internet, shared a masterclass on storytelling, creativity, and writing marketing that actually connects—showing how to find great ideas, turn real stories into memorable campaigns, and make people feel something in the process.
Head over to exitfive.com/drive to join the waitlist for Drive 2026 and be the first to know when tickets go on sale.
Timestamps
- (00:00) - – Intro from Dave
- (02:47) - – Harry’s background + Marketing Examples origin
- (05:07) - – What makes good marketing storytelling
- (08:27) - – How to find and collect great ideas
- (12:52) - – The power of emotion in copy
- (17:37) - – Why simple writing wins
- (22:12) - – Turning real stories into campaigns
- (29:08) - – The role of curiosity in great marketing
- (33:53) - – How to write like you talk
- (39:03) - – Examples of high-performing campaigns
- (44:13) - – Q&A: writing habits, inspiration, and burnout
Join 50,0000 people who get our Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Learn more about Exit Five's private marketing community: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
***
Today’s episode is brought to you by Paramark.
It’s November. 2026 planning is already here. And the stuff you’re doing right now will decide how next year plays out.
But here’s the problem: most teams are still planning next year's marketing strategy based on the WRONG DATA because of broken attribution and a misleading gut feel. And you can’t make smart budget calls if you’re just guessing what’s working, what’s not, and where to put your next dollar.
That’s where Paramark comes in. They help you replace the guesswork with actual insight backed by $2 billion in analyzed marketing data. They’ve figured out what actually drives incremental growth across every channel including LinkedIn, Meta, TikTok, Google, CTV, even OOH.
And right now, they’re offering a private 1:1 consultation with their CEO and CMO, Pranav and Sam, who have led marketing teams at companies like Dropbox, Adobe, Microsoft, and Shutterfly.
In this 45-minute strategy session, they’ll help you measure the real impact of every marketing dollar, pull insights from your current media mix, and design a 2026 roadmap that’s rooted in data, not gut.
This is a heck of an offer. And it’s real. And will go fast. So if you want to future-proof your marketing strategy for 2026, don’t miss out on this offer.
Grab your spot at Paramark.com/brand-consult
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
- They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.
- Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.
- Visit hatch.fm to learn more
Transcription
Gabe [0:00:00]: You're listening to B2B marketing with me, Dave Gerhardt.
Dave [0:00:17]: Hey, it's Dave Quick note before we get into this episode.
Dave [0:00:19]: This is a recording from drive twenty twenty five, our annual event.
Dave [0:00:23]: Here at Exit Five.
Dave [0:00:25]: This was recorded live in Burlington Vermont at Hula as part of our event.
Dave [0:00:29]: And we'd love to have you at next year's event.
Dave [0:00:31]: We're bringing it back to Vermont Stove vermont.
Dave [0:00:33]: You can go to Exit Five dot com slash drive to get more information, Put your name on the Way list and maybe make it to next year's event.
Dave [0:00:41]: But we're bringing the audio recordings from these sessions to you live, well, recorded on the podcast because we thought it'd be a fun way to show you the stuff we talk about a drive and give you a sense of what it was like, if you didn't get to be there.
Dave [0:00:54]: And if you were there, then you get to now re listen and maybe take notes again.
Dave [0:00:58]: So this is one of the sessions from Drive.
Dave [0:00:59]: Go and check it out, Get tickets, put your name on the wait list for next year, Exit Five dot com slash drive.
Dave [0:01:05]: If anybody's ever done an event before, this is the hardest transition ever.
Dave [0:01:10]: After lunch slot, and that's why I put Harry here, I'm super excited for this.
Dave [0:01:15]: But just thank you.
Dave [0:01:16]: Today's been so fun already.
Dave [0:01:18]: I'm buzzing.
Dave [0:01:19]: I don't know if it's because I had six cups of cold brew.
Dave [0:01:22]: Where's I guy Jeff Porter at.
Dave [0:01:24]: Jeff.
Dave [0:01:25]: I'm from New england.
Dave [0:01:26]: I'm from Worcester Mask.
Dave [0:01:27]: I say, he
Harry [0:01:28]: gonna dude.
Harry [0:01:28]: Nobody has.
Harry [0:01:28]: Because nobody has iced coffee at these events.
Harry [0:01:30]: Thank you so much.
Dave [0:01:34]: And I'm feeling that too.
Dave [0:01:34]: I've had plenty of it now.
Dave [0:01:35]: And we're ready to go.
Dave [0:01:36]: Oh, also, I meant to say this earlier, and someone just came up to me.
Dave [0:01:40]: And was like, you need to tell people about Sang book because it's up front.
Dave [0:01:43]: This is not like, a free promo like an ad or anything, but, like, he left a bunch of his books up here if you wanna grab them later.
Dave [0:01:49]: You you should grab them.
Dave [0:01:50]: Don't do it right now.
Dave [0:01:51]: Yeah.
Dave [0:01:52]: Take one now.
Dave [0:01:52]: Fuck.
Dave [0:01:53]: Whatever.
Dave [0:01:53]: Yeah.
Dave [0:01:55]: Go ahead.
Dave [0:01:56]: Alright.
Dave [0:01:57]: So we got nice afternoon.
Dave [0:01:58]: Again, like I said, we're never gonna be sitting for that long, hour and a half max at a time.
Dave [0:02:05]: I should've have gave him my affiliate link.
Dave [0:02:07]: What the hell?
Dave [0:02:07]: Eat you a dollar.
Dave [0:02:09]: One more one more to go.
Dave [0:02:10]: You're welcome.
Dave [0:02:11]: Sang ingram.
Dave [0:02:11]: So we got a nice little afternoon plan for you here at Drive.
Dave [0:02:15]: We're gonna roll that into...
Dave [0:02:17]: I know a bunch of joining us on a on a boat cruise tonight.
Dave [0:02:20]: We have a nice day tomorrow planned.
Dave [0:02:21]: Got nice little afternoon, and I'm I'm just having...
Dave [0:02:24]: I'm having a good ass time, and I'm
Gabe [0:02:25]: I'm really happy to be here with you all.
Gabe [0:02:27]: So...
Dave [0:02:28]: Okay.
Dave [0:02:28]: Our next speaker This is the guy I talked about in my talk this morning.
Dave [0:02:32]: I have heard a lot of people give him undue credit.
Dave [0:02:35]: He didn't actually...
Dave [0:02:35]: I picked the name Exit Five.
Dave [0:02:37]: Okay?
Dave [0:02:38]: He is a genius, but he didn't pick the name.
Dave [0:02:40]: I did.
Dave [0:02:41]: But he helped me talk me through it, which is great.
Dave [0:02:43]: He writes a popular newsletter that goes out to a hundred and fifty thousand marketers, and he's built one of the best swipe files out there.
Dave [0:02:50]: Anybody seen his site marketing examples dot com.
Dave [0:02:52]: Yeah hell Oh my gosh.
Dave [0:02:53]: Incredible.
Dave [0:02:54]: This man Is a Craftsman.
Dave [0:02:55]: He's here.
Dave [0:02:56]: He has hopped up on Celsius and Caffeine.
Dave [0:02:58]: He's an incredible marketer, storyteller, copywriter.
Dave [0:03:02]: We've been online friends for year and no joke.
Dave [0:03:05]: This is the first time we've ever seen each other in person.
Dave [0:03:07]: I know it's for a fact, the first time he's been in Vermont.
Dave [0:03:10]: And so I'm super excited to be here to kick off the afternoon session.
Dave [0:03:13]: Please give it up for mister Harry Dry.
Dave [0:03:19]: I remember Wow get.
Dave [0:03:20]: Yeah.
Dave [0:03:21]: Our house cut on fire.
Dave [0:03:22]: Never forget to look on my father's face.
Dave [0:03:26]: As he gathered me up in his arms and raced to the burning building out of the pavement.
Harry [0:03:34]: Does anybody know who invented the can.
Harry [0:03:35]: Or in France in eighteen ninety, and things not going well.
Harry [0:03:41]: Taxes are high people are they're unemployed, and the prices are up.
Harry [0:03:46]: And Louie, he should be running the the country, but he's got to hobby, and it's not gulf.
Harry [0:03:51]: It's look picking.
Harry [0:03:52]: And his wife's not not helping out too much easier than the people are in.
Harry [0:03:56]: Louie, new new nav include the flu pat.
Harry [0:03:58]: We have no bread and and Marie Antoinette saying Kill Mo let let me kick.
Harry [0:04:03]: So they get executed.
Harry [0:04:05]: This guy called.
Harry [0:04:07]: Napoleon rocks up, and naturally, he wants to take over the world.
Harry [0:04:12]: And he does a pretty good job.
Harry [0:04:15]: He marches the Spain, marches to Italy marches to Russia, but he's got a problem.
Harry [0:04:19]: The Frenchman that that as they march, they get him really hungry.
Harry [0:04:21]: So Napoleon sets fourteen dozen Francs reward for somebody to feed his army as they march.
Harry [0:04:29]: And you think this would be easy.
Harry [0:04:31]: That it wasn't.
Harry [0:04:32]: It took fifteen years.
Harry [0:04:33]: And this guy called nicholas a pear, invent this thing where he heat sterilize food in sealed containers.
Harry [0:04:40]: A year on, that becomes the camp.
Harry [0:04:42]: Napoleon's delighted.
Harry [0:04:44]: Now the can, Nobody's heard it, and you shouldn't have heard it, but it's it's changed the world much more than we'd think, like, Arctic nineteen eleven admins and makes his way to the the South pole, and the only guess there because of canned food.
Harry [0:04:58]: Tragically world war two world war one.
Harry [0:05:00]: Like, it would have been impossible to fight on that scale without the canned food.
Harry [0:05:04]: Sixteen billion cans were were were Eaten during the the war.
Harry [0:05:09]: One more, Neil Armstrong goes to space.
Harry [0:05:12]: The Apollo eleven up there for eight days.
Harry [0:05:14]: And what's the eating up there?
Harry [0:05:16]: Heat sterilized food and seals containers, nick Nicholas Sap invention.
Harry [0:05:20]: Why should we care nobody nobody knows about it.
Harry [0:05:22]: Comes about world war two four thousand nine hundred films about the can?
Harry [0:05:25]: One, Canon industry in California.
Harry [0:05:29]: Title.
Harry [0:05:30]: Now this is the part of the the talk where.
Harry [0:05:35]: I I segue, do you can't wrap it like, no one knows about like.
Harry [0:05:38]: You can't wrap it into compelling narrative, and nobody will give a shit.
Harry [0:05:41]: People think they make decisions on facts, they don't they're just responding to the shape of the story.
Harry [0:05:46]: It's really hard to tell a story I can.
Harry [0:05:47]: But Napoleon, well, what they could...
Harry [0:05:50]: These things are easy to tell stories about two million books have published each year.
Harry [0:05:54]: And H They right on Twitter.
Harry [0:05:57]: I'm incredibly proud that my new book is out now available to order.
Harry [0:06:00]: I'm incredibly proud of my books out available to order.
Harry [0:06:02]: I'm incredibly proud of my my books are available to ordering.
Harry [0:06:04]: I have a a good friend She and here we have to get an Ten.
Harry [0:06:08]: My brother is actually the real brains in the middle.
Harry [0:06:11]: Like, it is...
Harry [0:06:11]: But she didn't had the same problem.
Harry [0:06:14]: He's right the Book came out last week.
Harry [0:06:15]: And my mom sees in water stones, and I texted him and being like, we needed...
Harry [0:06:20]: We need to promote this.
Harry [0:06:21]: We need to promote this thing.
Harry [0:06:22]: You can't just write pre order my books available to to buy.
Harry [0:06:25]: So he sends me back and used to work at Mcdonald's straight after there we were in the University.
Harry [0:06:28]: He sends me back Mcdonald's comparison.
Harry [0:06:30]: I say to him.
Harry [0:06:31]: Yeah, Mcdonald's and you outside water stones, which is a British bookstore.
Harry [0:06:35]: Right.
Harry [0:06:36]: Three years never never stop dreaming one lie.
Harry [0:06:38]: So three years later never stop dreaming.
Harry [0:06:40]: He put on social media last week, three years later, never stop dreaming.
Harry [0:06:44]: Mcdonald's to to water stones and too many people see it.
Harry [0:06:47]: Same point, if you can't wrap it in a narrative, nobody is gonna care.
Harry [0:06:51]: People make decisions on people think they make decisions on facts.
Harry [0:06:54]: They don't.
Harry [0:06:55]: It's the shape of the story.
Harry [0:06:56]: Oh, we want B v.
Harry [0:06:59]: I hear the crowd.
Harry [0:07:00]: Hear the crowd dancing.
Harry [0:07:01]: We want B v.
Harry [0:07:02]: We want V.
Harry [0:07:02]: You didn't come to to Burlington for cans and books.
Harry [0:07:06]: So let's talk about Asana.
Harry [0:07:07]: Last year.
Harry [0:07:08]: Last year, Asana spent for hundred and forty five million dollars in advertising more than the Gdp of the Cook Islands.
Harry [0:07:16]: What I do with the money?
Harry [0:07:18]: They take out billboards?
Harry [0:07:19]: Say move work forward any team, any project, any goal, a smarter work.
Harry [0:07:25]: Their social media is a lot better.
Harry [0:07:26]: Whoever's doing doing them Ai generation, plus human intuition is...
Harry [0:07:30]: And it's...
Harry [0:07:31]: Equals negative innovative work.
Harry [0:07:32]: I'm a responsible brit.
Harry [0:07:34]: I would never I would never claim that the the state of Usa asana writing has anything to do with the share price falling ninety percent in five years.
Harry [0:07:41]: I would I would never I would never do that.
Harry [0:07:43]: I'd never do that.
Harry [0:07:44]: Asana.
Harry [0:07:45]: I...
Harry [0:07:46]: This is what I call the throw money and pray method.
Harry [0:07:49]: You raised twice the cash you hire twice the stuff.
Harry [0:07:53]: You spend twice as much on ads and you crush your fingers.
Harry [0:07:56]: And that's Asana.
Harry [0:07:57]: Now, Let me tell you about another project management company.
Harry [0:08:01]: Run by Jason Freed.
Harry [0:08:02]: I I emailed, Jason, and he told me they spent two million dollars on marked in every single year, and they got a similar number of of paying customers to Asana, They know spend four hundred million pounds on bill billboards, which say move move forward work forward.
Harry [0:08:14]: What what Jason and and David do They they wrote a book called rework, and it sold over a million copies, and they got paid ten million pounds for the privilege.
Harry [0:08:22]: This is what I call the learn writing or learn storytelling approach.
Harry [0:08:26]: Wanna grow twice as fast.
Harry [0:08:27]: You got you've got two choices.
Harry [0:08:28]: We throw money like Asana, we we learn how to how to tub story.
Harry [0:08:31]: I actually made an advert for Jason.
Harry [0:08:33]: This is storytelling.
Harry [0:08:34]: I haven't sent it to him yet, but it's called Irony, buying software to run your business.
Harry [0:08:40]: From companies losing half a billion every single year.
Harry [0:08:43]: The sign minus one point two atlas lasts in Monday smarts.
Harry [0:08:48]: Base comes is profitable.
Harry [0:08:49]: So that's storytelling
Dave [0:08:54]: anybody ever seen Goodwill hunting this one Wanna go, my guys wicked it's smart.
Harry [0:09:01]: Let's try and learn how to do it.
Harry [0:09:03]: It's not gonna be easy.
Harry [0:09:04]: I wanna you...
Harry [0:09:05]: If you're one thing from from this talk.
Harry [0:09:07]: Do not remember this.
Harry [0:09:08]: This is my storyteller starter pack, and it's...
Harry [0:09:11]: We need seven arcs.
Harry [0:09:12]: You've got the Linkedin entrepreneur and storyteller.
Harry [0:09:15]: Some of you are in the audience I no.
Harry [0:09:17]: You are.
Harry [0:09:17]: We believe coffee can change the world.
Harry [0:09:19]: Features.
Harry [0:09:20]: What what whatever...
Harry [0:09:21]: I think it's all a little bit more simple than.
Harry [0:09:23]: I wouldn't get bogged down in this.
Harry [0:09:24]: Story is what?
Harry [0:09:26]: But I I've given you some some examples so far, and every single one has the same cadence.
Harry [0:09:29]: I wanted to talk about my my friend She So I introduced other rights as who wrote right on Twitter about p their books.
Harry [0:09:36]: I wanna talk about Asana, so I introduced base camp.
Harry [0:09:40]: The foundation of every single story is is conflict.
Harry [0:09:42]: Like, if if there's no conflicts, no story.
Harry [0:09:44]: If you wanna be a little bit more technical, you're unresolved you create an unresolved tension and a you kind of resolve it, and that's...
Harry [0:09:51]: You've got a story hidden there.
Harry [0:09:52]: Okay?
Harry [0:09:53]: A little challenge for you all.
Harry [0:09:54]: Here is his nine books.
Harry [0:09:56]: The art of creative thinking, steal like an artist, the creative wound make brilliant work The art of brainstorming unfair advantage, find your artistic voice, the art creativity how to be an artist.
Harry [0:10:06]: One book sold more than every single level one combined.
Harry [0:10:09]: What is it?
Harry [0:10:10]: Why?
Harry [0:10:11]: Still like an honest, it's the only one with any kind of conflict in, There's no...
Harry [0:10:15]: There's not a conflict when you say make brilliant work.
Harry [0:10:18]: It just exists.
Harry [0:10:18]: Right?
Harry [0:10:19]: Still like an artist.
Harry [0:10:20]: Artists shouldn't be stealing like they're like, honorable revolt, you know, this conflict.
Harry [0:10:23]: So I'm gonna warm you up off after lunch, Rafael on the dial style.
Harry [0:10:27]: Will your partner, somewhere someone next year...
Harry [0:10:30]: I want you to rewrite these with conflict just to get the idea of introducing conflict into writing because it's really, really, really, really important.
Harry [0:10:36]: I think nearly writing could benefit from more conflict.
Harry [0:10:38]: So you got twenty seconds just twenty seconds with the person next to year.
Harry [0:10:42]: The cat said on the mat, how could you introduce conflict to this line?
Harry [0:10:45]: Hey, hey.
Harry [0:10:49]: Hey Hey.
Harry [0:10:49]: Hey.
Harry [0:10:50]: What do we got?
Harry [0:10:50]: Cool out.
Harry [0:10:52]: If you've got if you got to weeks.
Harry [0:10:53]: Hey.
Harry [0:10:54]: Wonderful.
Harry [0:10:55]: The cash shadow on the mat second road.
Harry [0:10:57]: Very good.
Harry [0:10:58]: Very good.
Harry [0:10:59]: Anymore anymore.
Harry [0:11:00]: One more.
Dave [0:11:03]: This is it the dog's that or the casa the dog man?
Harry [0:11:06]: My guy, Eddie Slater.
Harry [0:11:06]: Back.
Harry [0:11:07]: Probably stole there from you and.
Harry [0:11:09]: It's be.
Harry [0:11:09]: Now like, how you wanna think about Ko is is is I got this from Luke Sullivan.
Harry [0:11:15]: I think Luke's was absolutely brilliant.
Harry [0:11:17]: He is, we've got a rectangle.
Harry [0:11:18]: Alright?
Harry [0:11:18]: Just put line down the middle.
Harry [0:11:20]: And then you're looking for things which are dia opposed.
Harry [0:11:22]: So you got a cap.
Harry [0:11:23]: You you got a dog.
Harry [0:11:23]: Hold that fork for for the next one.
Harry [0:11:25]: You are a a social media manager, Youtube company and someone hands you this thumbnail.
Harry [0:11:30]: They've made this awesome image generation where usa s boat runs a hundred meters.
Harry [0:11:33]: Same principle twenty seconds with the person next to you.
Harry [0:11:35]: How could you introduce conflict to this title?
Harry [0:11:37]: Go.
Harry [0:11:38]: Oh Okay.
Harry [0:11:44]: Enough enough enough.
Harry [0:11:45]: What do we?
Harry [0:11:46]: Anyone got add anything on it shout out.
Harry [0:11:47]: Back back post.
Harry [0:11:48]: Got.
Harry [0:11:50]: Very good.
Harry [0:11:53]: Very good sir.
Harry [0:11:54]: One more?
Harry [0:11:54]: Faster than.
Harry [0:11:55]: Faster.
Harry [0:11:56]: I like it.
Harry [0:11:59]: They're a little bit simpler I feel like you guys are probably the better of the answer here.
Harry [0:12:02]: No.
Harry [0:12:02]: You say both versus cheaper.
Harry [0:12:03]: And it's it's the real video.
Harry [0:12:05]: It's got three point four million views.
Harry [0:12:06]: Who's actually only.
Harry [0:12:07]: This is a little bit of nerdy trivia for people are like write.
Harry [0:12:10]: And there's one Youtube channel in the universe with free videos and they all have over a million views.
Harry [0:12:15]: Usa say bolt it's the same channel.
Harry [0:12:17]: Usa saying boat versus cheat, Usa saying boat versus normal person, Usa saying boat versus Kill and Mbappe.
Harry [0:12:21]: That's a know conflict.
Harry [0:12:23]: We're just suckers for it.
Harry [0:12:25]: One more.
Harry [0:12:25]: Just like that my my twenty year marriage is over twenty seconds.
Harry [0:12:28]: Go go go.
Harry [0:12:29]: Rectangle left right.
Harry [0:12:31]: How could you introduce conflict?
Harry [0:12:32]: You'll being asked.
Harry [0:12:34]: Okay.
Harry [0:12:41]: I had enough.
Harry [0:12:42]: I had enough.
Harry [0:12:43]: Well, I've I got one more head.
Dave [0:12:45]: What did
Harry [0:12:45]: do you say?
Harry [0:12:45]: At the quote joseph.
Harry [0:12:48]: What are you go?
Harry [0:12:51]: Sorry.
Harry [0:12:52]: Top road.
Speaker_5 [0:12:53]: I just add the word.
Harry [0:12:54]: Again.
Harry [0:12:54]: Again, Like, the answer is though what this is a real article and how Would to view this?
Harry [0:13:02]: Is it, good writing is search for Jokes position.
Harry [0:13:05]: So we have twenty year marriage.
Harry [0:13:06]: And you have just it was originally just like that.
Harry [0:13:09]: You you wanna a little bit decisions.
Harry [0:13:11]: You wanna try and compare apples and apples.
Harry [0:13:12]: So twenty years to time, ten seconds is a time.
Harry [0:13:15]: Ten seconds that ended may my twenty year marriage.
Harry [0:13:17]: Last one, once again, a Youtube video.
Harry [0:13:19]: I'm begging you to read fiction.
Harry [0:13:21]: And we have the counter Monte K to tequila Mocking bird jack kerr on the road.
Harry [0:13:24]: Think about a rectangle you've got?
Harry [0:13:26]: Begging you to read fiction on the left.
Harry [0:13:28]: What could you put against it to make it more entertaining more and more interesting.
Harry [0:13:31]: I'm begging you to read Joe Rogan.
Harry [0:13:33]: Yeah.
Harry [0:13:34]: I...
Harry [0:13:34]: I know I like...
Harry [0:13:35]: You've got something there.
Harry [0:13:36]: What do you got?
Harry [0:13:37]: Robert green.
Harry [0:13:37]: Hey, you know it.
Harry [0:13:38]: You know it.
Harry [0:13:39]: Very well done.
Harry [0:13:40]: In real video, and what competes with fiction non fiction.
Harry [0:13:44]: Yeah I wanna get your mind working like this a little bit.
Harry [0:13:46]: And they need to read fiction, read bits the counter of monte cri not this Real real video.
Harry [0:13:50]: We're gonna we're gonna skip real own.
Harry [0:13:51]: Oh.
Harry [0:13:52]: I hear the chance.
Harry [0:13:53]: I hear the chance.
Harry [0:13:54]: We want B2B.
Harry [0:13:55]: We want we want B2B.
Harry [0:13:56]: Okay.
Harry [0:13:57]: I'll.
Harry [0:13:57]: I'll give it to you.
Harry [0:13:58]: Advisory work for ramp.
Harry [0:13:59]: And the founder that Eric often messages me move drafts for me to kinda try and improve and and this time around, they were rewrite sorry they were announcing a thirteen billion valuation.
Harry [0:14:08]: And Eric sent me this.
Harry [0:14:09]: Our mission remains the same to save you the customer time and money.
Harry [0:14:12]: It's a corporate card ramp, which saves companies time of money by eliminating busy work.
Harry [0:14:17]: So your team can focus on what matters most.
Harry [0:14:19]: And it's alright.
Harry [0:14:20]: It's it's not bad at all.
Harry [0:14:21]: I sent to him back.
Harry [0:14:22]: I said today...
Harry [0:14:23]: So today ramps reached an evaluation thirteen billion.
Harry [0:14:25]: I replied, how about today, ramp reached an new evaluation thirteen billion.
Harry [0:14:29]: We're not Steve Jobs or Wilbur ray.
Harry [0:14:31]: We won't invent the next iphone or fl machine.
Harry [0:14:34]: Now what do we have here?
Harry [0:14:35]: None of you know where this is going?
Harry [0:14:37]: This is unresolved tension.
Harry [0:14:38]: This is the point of this.
Harry [0:14:39]: This is conflict.
Harry [0:14:39]: And we continue, we're not Steve Jobs or will we're at.
Harry [0:14:42]: We won't invent the next iphone or fl machine.
Harry [0:14:44]: Our job is more modest.
Harry [0:14:46]: Save you time and money so perhaps you can.
Harry [0:14:48]: You got the rectangle.
Harry [0:14:50]: Right?
Harry [0:14:50]: So we have, on the left hand side, we're not the hero.
Harry [0:14:54]: We're not Steve Jobs or or mobile right.
Harry [0:14:56]: Right hand side you are.
Harry [0:14:57]: It's how I mind often conduct You posted it on social media and it it did quite well.
Harry [0:15:01]: Quick recap.
Harry [0:15:01]: But the first important thing The one thing I want need to remember.
Harry [0:15:03]: Story is conflict.
Harry [0:15:05]: It's really...
Harry [0:15:05]: Is all you need to know.
Harry [0:15:07]: Story story is conflict.
Harry [0:15:07]: Nearly all writing could benefit from more conflict.
Harry [0:15:09]: Claus skin first makeup second.
Harry [0:15:12]: I think it's a really good tagline for Instagram one more.
Harry [0:15:14]: But this people Nit swim school, others do lessons we teach swimming.
Harry [0:15:19]: It's not just we teach swimming like everyone else is saying.
Harry [0:15:22]: That's part one.
Harry [0:15:23]: Now part two, not a very good title.
Harry [0:15:26]: It's your story.
Harry [0:15:27]: And Let's start with some some definitions, just so kind of on the same page.
Harry [0:15:30]: Positioning April is gonna talk about it tomorrow.
Harry [0:15:32]: Very simply, It's just we do this.
Harry [0:15:34]: We do x.
Harry [0:15:35]: Story is why we do x.
Harry [0:15:38]: Right?
Harry [0:15:38]: And the point of the story is to point at.
Harry [0:15:41]: Your position or or make it make sense.
Harry [0:15:44]: That's the point of the story.
Harry [0:15:45]: Like a little error like this.
Harry [0:15:47]: So I'm just gonna show you this with a few examples.
Harry [0:15:48]: Luke.
Harry [0:15:49]: The position is video messaging for work.
Harry [0:15:51]: That's what it is.
Harry [0:15:52]: Story, Why work's gone remote, but the way remote teams communicate sucks.
Harry [0:15:58]: Meetings are boring calls drag on emails lack personality.
Harry [0:16:01]: So the solution, video messaging for work, the the position the story points at the positioning it makes it makes sense.
Harry [0:16:08]: One more example, I train markers and writing.
Harry [0:16:11]: So my position very simple where marketers learn copy.
Harry [0:16:14]: The job of the story is to make the positioning makes sense.
Harry [0:16:18]: Positioning storytelling, home homepage hooks offers add social Cro, email sales It's all what.
Harry [0:16:25]: It's all...
Harry [0:16:25]: It's all writing.
Harry [0:16:26]: Mark has spend twenty two thousand hours of their career writing.
Harry [0:16:29]: Spend a couple learn how to do it well.
Harry [0:16:31]: No one's trained and how to do it well.
Harry [0:16:32]: So copy where Mark has learned copywriting writing.
Harry [0:16:35]: That's the position.
Harry [0:16:35]: And the story makes it makes sense.
Harry [0:16:37]: Last one, pepper bras, a better fitting bras for Aa and and b cups.
Harry [0:16:42]: Story, your bra probably doesn't fit because it wasn't made for you.
Harry [0:16:46]: The industry designs around the thirty six c base, then they apply that standard base to all sizes.
Harry [0:16:52]: That's why you get cup gaps, and then we got the position, we design just for a, aa a and b.
Harry [0:16:57]: If you just say we design just for aa a and b.
Harry [0:16:59]: Why?
Harry [0:17:00]: Well, the story explains it.
Harry [0:17:02]: Right?
Harry [0:17:02]: How do you do the story pie?
Harry [0:17:04]: Well, let's start with story stories conflict.
Harry [0:17:06]: Now really, what does conflict need in any needs enemies, And there's free and and only free enemies any company can have?
Harry [0:17:12]: The first one is is directly about.
Harry [0:17:14]: So this would be Apple and Mac for Vodka brand, it would be what other vodka.
Harry [0:17:18]: So S shire, where's the conflict?
Harry [0:17:21]: So direct competitor, the other vodka because most American vodka seem Russian, sol...
Harry [0:17:25]: S shire is different is Russia.
Harry [0:17:27]: Okay.
Harry [0:17:28]: Second enemy competing approaches.
Harry [0:17:30]: This is a different way of solving the same problem?
Harry [0:17:33]: So you could take the tube to work?
Harry [0:17:36]: Or you could cycle there?
Harry [0:17:37]: There could be in the.
Harry [0:17:37]: You could take the tube to work or you could take the train.
Harry [0:17:40]: So there's an ad for the London underground in, Think nineteen sixty something or take the tube.
Harry [0:17:45]: Where's the conflict the enemy is is taxis.
Harry [0:17:47]: How how slow they are.
Harry [0:17:48]: Finally, beliefs beliefs you stand against.
Harry [0:17:51]: You don't pool beliefs out your backside they come from your product, and they kind of point back it as well.
Harry [0:17:56]: So for example, cruise self driving cars.
Harry [0:17:59]: Direct competitor would be other self driving cars, compete an approach would be human beings driving to work, and the belief for an enemy would be that humans are terrible drivers.
Harry [0:18:08]: We believe humans are terrible drivers.
Harry [0:18:11]: Forty two thousand seven nine five Americans were killed last year in car crashes.
Harry [0:18:15]: It's really easy to remember this.
Harry [0:18:16]: Just a b c.
Harry [0:18:17]: A approaches, b, belief, c, c competitors.
Harry [0:18:20]: Now the question is, how do you, like, cool.
Harry [0:18:23]: But, like, how do we know what our enemy is.
Harry [0:18:24]: And I think April Dun has a question which really helps with this.
Harry [0:18:28]: I actually this is the most important question in marketing.
Harry [0:18:31]: What are we actually competing against?
Harry [0:18:33]: So we had Loom earlier?
Harry [0:18:35]: Meetings are boring calls drag on emails lack personality.
Harry [0:18:39]: Why are we talking about meetings calls and email because Loom competes against emails, calls an email.
Harry [0:18:45]: Meetings calls and email.
Harry [0:18:46]: I talked about about copy.
Harry [0:18:48]: What am I competing against?
Harry [0:18:49]: I'm competing against the belief that marketers should not learn writing.
Harry [0:18:53]: That's the the belief.
Harry [0:18:54]: I don't need to learn this?
Harry [0:18:55]: I do my job of who no.
Harry [0:18:57]: Why don't Need learn this?
Harry [0:18:58]: So that's the conflict.
Harry [0:18:59]: Do I really to learn copywriting?
Harry [0:19:00]: Yes, that is the most important skill marketing.
Harry [0:19:03]: And finally, Pepper, very simple.
Harry [0:19:04]: What the compete against other bras direct competitor the industry designed around a thirty sixty base.
Harry [0:19:09]: That's why we're talking about the Bra industry.
Harry [0:19:11]: Very quick Recap.
Harry [0:19:12]: Your positioning is we do x, Your story is why we do x?
Harry [0:19:15]: Story is conflict as free enemies.
Harry [0:19:18]: You can create these conflicts from direct competitors, competing approaches or all beliefs you choose to stand against.
Harry [0:19:23]: How do you work these out?
Harry [0:19:25]: You ask a you start with the April question.
Harry [0:19:26]: What do we actually competing against?
Harry [0:19:28]: Okay.
Harry [0:19:29]: That's a very simple way of understanding story.
Harry [0:19:31]: Now let's talk about storytelling.
Harry [0:19:32]: Let me explain this.
Harry [0:19:33]: So positioning we do x stories is why, and the storytelling is getting it inside the customer's head.
Harry [0:19:38]: So base camp position refreshing simple project management.
Harry [0:19:41]: Here's the story.
Harry [0:19:42]: Modern work is messy, documents hear tasks there.
Harry [0:19:45]: Your slight links about meetings.
Harry [0:19:46]: They're talking about this stuff because they compete against it.
Harry [0:19:49]: They're trying to reposition it.
Harry [0:19:50]: It's like sitting in a wind tunnel with different apps, fly up you and it's impossible to get any work done.
Harry [0:19:55]: It doesn't have to be this way.
Harry [0:19:57]: For nearly two decades, we've been refining and base camp to be what the simplest way to manage projects.
Harry [0:20:01]: Now let's talk about storytelling.
Harry [0:20:03]: All the different ways you you tell the story, how you get it into the customer's head.
Harry [0:20:07]: Years ago, base camp ran up promote a tweet that said Slack is the day long meeting him with no agenda.
Harry [0:20:12]: That's storytelling.
Harry [0:20:13]: Okay?
Harry [0:20:14]: On their home homepage, same thing.
Harry [0:20:16]: Storytelling.
Harry [0:20:17]: Do a Vp of wasting my time, just let me do my job storytelling.
Harry [0:20:21]: Free books rework, It doesn't have to be crazy at work remote.
Harry [0:20:25]: Therefore base cam.
Harry [0:20:27]: Okay.
Harry [0:20:28]: Andy asking find your company's version of six pack abs and you tell the story over and over again from different angles.
Harry [0:20:33]: So that's what you're trying to do.
Harry [0:20:34]: You have you have a very simple story and you tell it again and again and again and again.
Harry [0:20:38]: Now there's five, I've called them in immutable, they're actually very immutable, Laws of storytelling, and we've talked about conflict.
Harry [0:20:44]: No conflict no story.
Harry [0:20:46]: No people, no story.
Harry [0:20:48]: No butts and so, no story.
Harry [0:20:50]: No ordinary.
Harry [0:20:50]: No story.
Harry [0:20:51]: If you start explaining no story.
Harry [0:20:53]: And I'm gonna start off by seeing Mark Zuckerberg break them all with this.
Harry [0:20:57]: He he wrote last month about personal super intelligence.
Harry [0:21:00]: And I'll pull out some highlights.
Harry [0:21:02]: In some ways, this will be a new era for humanity.
Harry [0:21:05]: Super intelligence will help humanity accelerate our pace of progress.
Harry [0:21:09]: People have used our newfound productivity to achieve more than was previously possible.
Harry [0:21:13]: Meta believe strongly in building personal super intelligence that empowers everyone.
Harry [0:21:17]: So we got no people, No butts or so.
Harry [0:21:21]: Nothing ordinary.
Harry [0:21:22]: It's all high, super intelligence, and it's a whole long explanation.
Harry [0:21:29]: The whole thing.
Harry [0:21:30]: It's one big explanation.
Harry [0:21:31]: The great explanation.
Harry [0:21:32]: Let's start with with no people no story.
Harry [0:21:34]: Okay?
Harry [0:21:35]: Stories are are about people.
Harry [0:21:36]: This sounds incredibly simple, but you won't believe how people forget it.
Harry [0:21:39]: I got given a brief ramp.
Harry [0:21:41]: Right in now that shows that ramps development team are cutting edge.
Harry [0:21:44]: Now you get a brief like this Like, the obvious thing to do is talk about how ramp automate everything.
Harry [0:21:50]: Sprint cycles, coding languages.
Harry [0:21:53]: It's not very interesting.
Harry [0:21:54]: So I was in new York when I got set this task and I went over to the development team.
Harry [0:21:59]: And there was a bunch of them there, and there's this one guy called Calvin.
Harry [0:22:02]: And I was smiling thinking about Calvin.
Harry [0:22:04]: And he was very odd.
Harry [0:22:05]: It's very odd He was very funny.
Harry [0:22:06]: And I guess, let's talk about Calvin.
Harry [0:22:07]: So I came up with one Kelvin to filed your expenses.
Harry [0:22:10]: Well, I read a couple of the lines.
Harry [0:22:12]: Meet Calvin.
Harry [0:22:13]: I got talking to him.
Harry [0:22:14]: At eleven, he was fluent in Python.
Harry [0:22:15]: At fifteen, his code was running on the international space station.
Harry [0:22:19]: At sixteen, he dropped at a high school and was admitted into Mit.
Harry [0:22:22]: He graduated one and a half years early with a perfect Gp.
Harry [0:22:25]: At seventeen, he represented the United States, not in Hockey and hacking, and nineteen he was hired by Google.
Harry [0:22:31]: This is the conflict now.
Harry [0:22:33]: Now you're probably wondering how a boy genius like Calvin ends up fire an expenses for a living.
Harry [0:22:39]: Now let me tell you a twenty who joined rampant and he wrote the code that made filing and expense as easy as taken a photograph of a receipt.
Harry [0:22:46]: A thousand expenses are now filed this way.
Harry [0:22:49]: I don't wanna talk about automation.
Harry [0:22:51]: Story If you wanna get people attention until what you wanna talk about people real people.
Harry [0:22:54]: Again, it ended up doing quite well on Linkedin.
Harry [0:22:56]: While I was at ramp, I got I got another it.
Harry [0:22:58]: I got I read a customer quote.
Harry [0:23:00]: Ramp is like getting out of a messy relationship and finding the one.
Harry [0:23:03]: I thought Was really good quote, but I kinda wanted to like, how can Bring this to life?
Harry [0:23:06]: Like that's not really a story.
Harry [0:23:07]: Right?
Harry [0:23:08]: Stories about people.
Harry [0:23:09]: So I thought, how could we mate?
Harry [0:23:12]: How could we turn that line into two people.
Harry [0:23:14]: At the wedding day and ramps the engagement ring till death do us part.
Harry [0:23:18]: Again, once again, they did quite a long on social media.
Harry [0:23:21]: Rule free.
Harry [0:23:21]: No butts and so, no.
Harry [0:23:23]: No story.
Harry [0:23:24]: What I mean by this is this is came from two south park writers.
Harry [0:23:27]: And what they said when they're when they write is if when you stick your little story together, the the word and is in between all these sentences.
Harry [0:23:34]: You haven't got a story, you got a shopping list.
Harry [0:23:36]: What you see between the center should be Don't but.
Harry [0:23:40]: So I came to Burlington but.
Harry [0:23:42]: I nearly missed my flight.
Harry [0:23:43]: So I dashed through terminal six.
Harry [0:23:46]: That's kind thing.
Harry [0:23:46]: Okay?
Harry [0:23:47]: Now, you're gonna see family guy do it really well here.
Speaker_6 [0:23:50]: Ga it A train.
Speaker_6 [0:23:51]: Love it.
Harry [0:23:58]: All aboard.
Speaker_6 [0:24:03]: Alright.
Speaker_6 [0:24:03]: Everybody.
Speaker_6 [0:24:04]: This is it?
Speaker_6 [0:24:04]: Hey.
Speaker_6 [0:24:05]: Wait hell is everybody?
Speaker_3 [0:24:06]: Oh, we haven't had a paying customer in monster and nobody rides a train anymore.
Speaker_6 [0:24:10]: Oh, well, for god's sake.
Speaker_6 [0:24:12]: God.
Speaker_6 [0:24:12]: Are are you Robbers?
Speaker_6 [0:24:14]: Yeah.
Speaker_3 [0:24:17]: Well, you could you could take my wallet, my mastercard in there, although, to be honest, I'll probably cancel it before you can use it.
Speaker_3 [0:24:23]: So...
Speaker_6 [0:24:27]: Give me a whole punch.
Speaker_6 [0:24:28]: Yeah.
Speaker_6 [0:24:29]: Is this this is this your whole punch or a train companies?
Speaker_3 [0:24:33]: Well, that's, you know, what, know, I gotta I gotta pay for that.
Speaker_3 [0:24:35]: That that comes out of my paycheck if you you could take it.
Speaker_6 [0:24:38]: Oh, oh, really?
Speaker_6 [0:24:39]: Yeah.
Speaker_6 [0:24:40]: Well, I can't in all good conscience take that, then.
Speaker_6 [0:24:42]: Oh.
Speaker_6 [0:24:43]: Oh,
Speaker_3 [0:24:43]: good.
Speaker_3 [0:24:43]: Thank you.
Speaker_3 [0:24:44]: Yeah.
Speaker_3 [0:24:44]: That's...
Speaker_3 [0:24:45]: Yeah.
Speaker_6 [0:24:45]: No.
Speaker_6 [0:24:45]: I'm I'm with it.
Speaker_6 [0:24:46]: I'm working man myself oh.
Speaker_3 [0:24:47]: It's stuff out there yeah.
Michael [0:24:49]: Yeah let's try...
Speaker_6 [0:24:50]: In his on way.
Speaker_6 [0:24:51]: Alright.
Speaker_6 [0:24:52]: Well, can you stop this thing so We can get off?
Speaker_3 [0:24:56]: No.
Speaker_3 [0:24:56]: I mean, I'd love to, but it it stops at the pre doesn't need stops.
Speaker_3 [0:25:00]: You know.
Speaker_3 [0:25:00]: Okay.
Harry [0:25:01]: So busting so we'll drives the story?
Harry [0:25:02]: So You have these sentences and you have butts so in between now, you'll see this with this Peter goes to to Rubber train.
Harry [0:25:07]: But no one's on the train.
Harry [0:25:09]: But the guard doesn't even mind being robbed.
Harry [0:25:11]: He's gonna offer his card, but they'll see as he'll cancel it, so Peter steals the whole punch.
Harry [0:25:17]: But the guards said it's gonna cost a lot of money, so Peter decides to not rob the train.
Harry [0:25:21]: So he asked to get off, but he can't get off and it is this constant sort of but so but which keeps your interest.
Harry [0:25:27]: Okay?
Harry [0:25:27]: Number four, no ordinary, no story.
Harry [0:25:30]: It's easier to to make so small feel big than the other way around.
Harry [0:25:34]: So you're a little very simple graph.
Harry [0:25:36]: Here We got big at the top and smaller at the bottom.
Harry [0:25:37]: And your company like Google.
Harry [0:25:40]: It's very easy to brag about stuff, like, ten billion searches.
Harry [0:25:42]: That feels really big, but It's much easier to start small with one search, and then you can make that feel big, and you'll see this here with this with this advert.
Derek [0:25:59]: Hello
Harry [0:26:42]: Do you you start small.
Harry [0:26:43]: So I my favorite part of the ad is when these types long this distance since relationship, then he any backspace spaces at and any he types job jobs in Paris.
Harry [0:26:50]: So you wanna, like, continuously be trying to add conflict things.
Harry [0:26:52]: Jobs in Paris no.
Harry [0:26:53]: He's questioning himself.
Harry [0:26:55]: One more.
Harry [0:26:55]: This was actually quite emotional.
Harry [0:26:57]: I'm been serious.
Harry [0:26:58]: Basically, this Guy Warren and Z yvonne, who, hoping some of you know, and he sadly died from pancreatic cancer, and he on his last album.
Harry [0:27:06]: His last ever song.
Harry [0:27:07]: It was about his wife and it it was he's telling his wife like, words could be like what he's gone.
Harry [0:27:14]: And he's not talking about grief.
Harry [0:27:16]: He's talking him about clean the house, and the song lyric is sometimes when you're doing simple things around the house, maybe you'll think of me and smile.
Harry [0:27:23]: And it's actually my boyfriend my favorite song of a full time because, like, he's not trying to make it big.
Harry [0:27:30]: He's trying to make it small, and that's what stories are about.
Harry [0:27:33]: Right bringing it back to B2B now.
Harry [0:27:35]: Ram our favorite...
Harry [0:27:38]: Our favorite company.
Harry [0:27:39]: We walk around the New York office.
Harry [0:27:41]: Everybody.
Harry [0:27:41]: Everybody keeps talking at these billions of hours they they save in, I don't like, that's not like, great.
Harry [0:27:48]: Like, it's really impressive.
Harry [0:27:48]: And I'm it's gonna win you some big deals, but, like, it's not gonna take off, like, everyone claims these big numbers.
Harry [0:27:53]: So let's say we were doing a sales deck.
Harry [0:27:54]: And this guy jack was like, like, let's not start with billions of hours.
Harry [0:27:58]: Let's start with some milk, like, customers do every single day.
Harry [0:28:01]: They buy a cup of coffee.
Harry [0:28:02]: So we we set up a slide, How much does a coffee cost?
Harry [0:28:05]: Five five dollars.
Harry [0:28:06]: Every single employee at your company is gonna expense a cup of coffee at one point.
Harry [0:28:10]: You think it costs five dollars.
Harry [0:28:12]: The real cost of a five dollar coffee.
Harry [0:28:14]: Employee uploads and tags to the expense.
Harry [0:28:17]: That's three minutes.
Harry [0:28:17]: Manager stops what they were doing to approve one minute finance hunts for the expense four minutes, double checks it one minute matches receipt, finance finance finally reconcile Cost of a five dollar cup of coffee is free employees for interruptions thirty minutes.
Harry [0:28:32]: It's a little bit more impactful than just bragging about billions.
Harry [0:28:35]: Final, immutable, brackets very immutable law.
Harry [0:28:38]: If you start explaining no story.
Harry [0:28:41]: Spare me the explanation.
Harry [0:28:43]: Give me an example.
Harry [0:28:43]: Every time you explain something.
Harry [0:28:45]: Backspace it and just write an example.
Harry [0:28:47]: I'm not kidding.
Harry [0:28:48]: So hunting thing.
Harry [0:28:49]: Dave referenced it earlier.
Harry [0:28:51]: He's sitting on the bench venture wheel.
Harry [0:28:52]: And what does he say?
Harry [0:28:53]: He says, missus is Robin Williams talking him about matt Damon.
Harry [0:28:55]: He says, loves an act an active commitment, will.
Harry [0:28:58]: It's the choice to value someone else's well being as much as your own.
Harry [0:29:01]: Now, you don't Robin Williams doesn't say that on the bench.
Harry [0:29:04]: That's that.
Harry [0:29:05]: You you don't explain love.
Harry [0:29:06]: He said you wouldn't know about sleeping sitting up in the hospital room for two months because the doctor us could see in your eyes the terms business hours don't apply.
Harry [0:29:14]: You give an example.
Harry [0:29:15]: You're trying to explain to me Just give an example.
Harry [0:29:16]: It's all I've done today.
Harry [0:29:18]: Last little story, and it's the...
Harry [0:29:20]: I across the Atlantic, ocean three times in my life.
Harry [0:29:23]: This is the third.
Harry [0:29:24]: And I'm gonna tell you by the first time two years ago.
Harry [0:29:27]: I was...
Harry [0:29:28]: I was in the bahamas.
Harry [0:29:29]: And with my friends we having dinner.
Harry [0:29:32]: And there's his guy there.
Harry [0:29:33]: And he was really interesting.
Harry [0:29:34]: He was talking me about schools in America, and he's got this like, Ai school thing going on at America and Didn't know who he was.
Harry [0:29:41]: And then my friend not just been is he's like, you know that that guy is like, one of the richest people in the world.
Harry [0:29:46]: I didn't know and it's not something particularly brag about, but but anyhow, the kind of level of money where I'm I'm not gonna mention his name, but you could you could probably work it out.
Harry [0:29:52]: So I said to him.
Harry [0:29:53]: How are you gonna get parents to pick your schools instead of like the ones you all send your kids to right now and he was the kind of guy.
Harry [0:30:01]: He just look looked at me dead the eyes, and he said, I it wasn't even arrogant.
Harry [0:30:04]: And he said, I know more about the problem with the education system in America than anybody in America.
Harry [0:30:08]: Go.
Harry [0:30:09]: And I believed them.
Harry [0:30:10]: And I think when we talk about story something how to get better at stories.
Harry [0:30:13]: We get really bogged down in, like, in technique.
Harry [0:30:16]: Really, what you wanna do if you wanna tell a stories.
Harry [0:30:19]: You wanna have a story to tell and how how you do those?
Harry [0:30:21]: You wanna know more about the problem with your category.
Harry [0:30:23]: Than anybody else in the category or anyone else in America.
Harry [0:30:26]: And honestly, the rest will take care of itself.
Harry [0:30:28]: You're like a dog with a bone, and the problems the bone.
Harry [0:30:31]: Alright?
Harry [0:30:32]: You shouldn't know so much about your category you could write a book on it.
Harry [0:30:35]: That's the test.
Harry [0:30:36]: You might actually wanna get better at storytelling, stop reading books.
Harry [0:30:39]: Right one.
Harry [0:30:40]: The title is we do it this way.
Harry [0:30:42]: We do...
Harry [0:30:43]: Our company does it this way because.
Harry [0:30:44]: So drift conversational marketing instinct mister Go name is on the front Pi and data cancel.
Harry [0:30:50]: Conversational marketing therefore drift.
Harry [0:30:53]: The canine ko effect, a breakthrough to healing your dog's gut with super fat.
Harry [0:30:58]: That's the story of the book.
Harry [0:30:59]: Therefore Jung.
Harry [0:31:00]: The roast therefore bio.
Harry [0:31:03]: This isn't about the the book actually.
Harry [0:31:05]: It's about put your ideas in into words.
Harry [0:31:09]: That's how you know you you only know you've got a good idea when you start writing it down.
Harry [0:31:13]: People say base can be good at story, and I agree.
Harry [0:31:15]: I think they are.
Harry [0:31:16]: But the guys who run the company have written, like, over a hundred essays on project management.
Harry [0:31:20]: It's not surprising.
Harry [0:31:21]: And then everyone's like, we can't do it.
Harry [0:31:24]: You haven't...
Harry [0:31:24]: You haven't when awesome some you're an essay about about your product.
Harry [0:31:26]: You could give Zuckerberg essay, ironically personal super intelligence to the best storyteller in the world, and they couldn't do anything with it.
Harry [0:31:35]: Because he's got nothing to say in the first place.
Harry [0:31:38]: John Ru, to be taught to right, but what is the use if you've got nothing to say.
Harry [0:31:42]: In the absence of knowledge, this is Bob Evans.
Harry [0:31:44]: You will be doomed to rely more and more an adjective, Always a mistake.
Harry [0:31:48]: So you came to Burlington thing probably not, but perhaps you wanted to learn a little bit about about storytelling.
Harry [0:31:53]: Well, there's no secret If you want a secret fill up your water bottle before you you start hiking.
Harry [0:31:58]: What I'm gonna leave with is just like, it's honestly this simple.
Harry [0:32:01]: Forget ask and why whatnot, Just know your shit.
Harry [0:32:04]: I'm being serious when I when I say that, like, when the chap on the bahamas told me.
Harry [0:32:08]: He knows more about the problem with the education system in America.
Harry [0:32:11]: I spent the next couple trying to understand more about the the problem with my industry advertising than than anybody in America.
Harry [0:32:17]: I'm not sure I'm probably a a long way off, but that's It's meat.
Harry [0:32:20]: It gives me meat to come on come up here and talk about.
Harry [0:32:23]: Finally, I'm mean just gonna take your little peek behind the curtain.
Harry [0:32:26]: And it's.
Harry [0:32:27]: If any writer was totally honest.
Harry [0:32:28]: This is what their work looks like.
Harry [0:32:30]: And I was writing a story about my business where I train marketers to to write.
Harry [0:32:34]: And, I'll read it to you and then I'll tell you where it came from?
Harry [0:32:37]: Perhaps to try and inspire you a little bit to write a essays to read to re books.
Harry [0:32:41]: Close your eyes.
Harry [0:32:42]: Can you tell me an ad you remember from last week?
Harry [0:32:45]: I'm trying to explain the problem with the advertising industry?
Harry [0:32:48]: Or how companies do marketing.
Harry [0:32:52]: Close rights.
Harry [0:32:52]: Can you tell
Speaker_6 [0:32:53]: me and
Harry [0:32:53]: add you you remember from last week.
Harry [0:32:54]: It's the decade of s mushy flavor from lunch lady Doris is ladle to your homepage.
Harry [0:32:59]: We gum together the same abstract verbs Nouns adjectives in different combinations and call it, copywriting.
Harry [0:33:06]: Imagine spending a hundred million dollars a year on advertising to tell me, move work forward, smash your marketing goes, drive business value of sustainability data.
Harry [0:33:15]: Do you know what any of these companies do do you remember any of their drift?
Harry [0:33:18]: Writing a skill school you don't have it you learn it?
Harry [0:33:20]: That's why I made this.
Harry [0:33:21]: Now, to story.
Harry [0:33:23]: Right?
Harry [0:33:23]: But, like, I didn't just...
Harry [0:33:24]: I didn't write it.
Harry [0:33:25]: First line, Close your close your eyes.
Harry [0:33:26]: Can you tell me and add you remember from last week?
Harry [0:33:28]: On the plane, I looked at this, and I started thinking how subconsciously where where it all came from.
Harry [0:33:32]: John long, The problem with be advertising industry in a nutshell How many current ads can you remember in in ten seconds.
Harry [0:33:37]: That's what inspired the the first line.
Harry [0:33:39]: Second little bit.
Harry [0:33:40]: We've come them together the same apps verbs nouns, adjectives and different combinations and cool it copy writing.
Harry [0:33:45]: We gum them together.
Harry [0:33:46]: That's George you're well.
Harry [0:33:47]: As I have tried to show modern writing at its worst does not consist in picking out words for the sake of their meaning, and inventing images in order to make the meaning clearer.
Harry [0:33:56]: It consists in gum together long strips of words which have been set in order by somebody else.
Harry [0:34:01]: The third little bit, drive business value with sustainability data.
Harry [0:34:05]: As Dave Holland, I saw it on on social media, a wonderful copywriter, a few months ago.
Harry [0:34:11]: Three point six trillion dollars.
Harry [0:34:14]: Why do we bother and he's screenshot Microsoft adverts drive business value was sustainability data.
Harry [0:34:18]: And finally, the end, ratings are skill, you don't have it you learn it.
Harry [0:34:22]: This was thai Nasty Coats right in the Atlantic.
Harry [0:34:25]: One of my students insisted the wearer in math, you could practice and get better in writing you even had it or you didn't.
Harry [0:34:34]: I told her that writing was more like math than she suspected.
Harry [0:34:38]: I suppose my point, if if I have what this, If you spend time doing the work.
Harry [0:34:44]: When it's time to sit behind your keyboard, it will all work out.
Harry [0:34:47]: And if you haven't spend any time to actually do the work and understand your problem in the category.
Harry [0:34:51]: When it's time to sit behind the keyboard, you'll just gone together verbs and adjectives like Mark Zuckerberg.
Harry [0:34:57]: Final summary, you can't wrap it in a compelling narrative.
Harry [0:35:01]: Nobody cares.
Harry [0:35:02]: Right?
Harry [0:35:02]: Positioning, we do this story, why we do this.
Harry [0:35:06]: Storytelling telling how you get it in the customer's head.
Harry [0:35:09]: In one word story conflict?
Harry [0:35:11]: Where does that conflict come from?
Harry [0:35:13]: You need enemies, direct competitors competing the approaches beliefs.
Harry [0:35:17]: A b.
Harry [0:35:19]: No conflict, no story, No people, no story.
Harry [0:35:22]: No butts that so is no story.
Harry [0:35:24]: Nothing ordinary, no no story.
Harry [0:35:27]: If you start explaining, no story.
Harry [0:35:30]: And, one little thing to take away.
Harry [0:35:32]: Perhaps, I know more about the problem with My category, my product than anybody in America.
Harry [0:35:38]: Honestly, you'll be fine.
Harry [0:35:39]: Thank very much for listening.
Dave [0:35:43]: We got questions.
Dave [0:35:43]: We're gonna hang out.
Dave [0:35:44]: That was that was excellent.
Dave [0:35:46]: I wanna kick off the first question and let's take...
Dave [0:35:48]: This is amazing.
Dave [0:35:49]: Thank you.
Dave [0:35:50]: So on the on the, like, you gotta know your shit thing.
Dave [0:35:52]: Right?
Dave [0:35:52]: This came this comes up a lot.
Dave [0:35:53]: I think with us in in the room as marketers.
Dave [0:35:55]: It's, like, a lot of times, you're...
Dave [0:35:57]: Not all of us are fortunate enough to be able to, like, pick a company as a marketer and go work a company where the founder knows the industry and cares a lot about the product.
Dave [0:36:08]: Right?
Dave [0:36:08]: So a lot of times, we're asked to basically put lipstick on a pig in some ways.
Dave [0:36:13]: Do you believe that we can, like, the people in this room as marketers Can we be the the person that forces that inside of the company to, like, make the founder?
Dave [0:36:22]: Know the shit?
Dave [0:36:23]: Yeah.
Speaker_6 [0:36:24]: It's a good question, Dave.
Speaker_6 [0:36:24]: I got an.
Speaker_6 [0:36:25]: I got
Harry [0:36:25]: a funny answer.
Harry [0:36:25]: So these two ads My made for ramp.
Harry [0:36:28]: I said that I was given a brief.
Harry [0:36:30]: I'm Gonna just quickly flash back to them.
Harry [0:36:32]: It wasn't actually true.
Harry [0:36:33]: I I just added that because it kind just tied together the story.
Harry [0:36:35]: I didn't I didn't get.
Harry [0:36:36]: I didn't get a brief.
Harry [0:36:37]: And let me just find them quick.
Harry [0:36:38]: I was in the New York office and they kinda told me to do some work.
Harry [0:36:41]: And honestly, I didn't really do the work, and I just met this guy called Calvin, and I was like, this is this is gonna be good.
Harry [0:36:46]: And I started writing it, and I just texted the founder, and then free hours later, he'd he put it on social media, and it it did pretty well.
Harry [0:36:52]: You got...
Harry [0:36:52]: I think you gotta take matters your hands.
Harry [0:36:54]: This other one, I didn't get asked to do it.
Harry [0:36:56]: I just I just kinda did it because I wanted to.
Harry [0:36:58]: And, again, it did quite well on social media and I I think force it by, like, I do the work and then just text it.
Harry [0:37:04]: And if if they keep saying, no maybe get another job.
Dave [0:37:07]: And then I have more this is my event also.
Dave [0:37:09]: I'm gonna ask you questions on my own.
Dave [0:37:11]: This is an interesting role with ram.
Dave [0:37:13]: So, like, your b b thing.
Dave [0:37:14]: This is a cool example, and I think the ramping thing is like, okay.
Dave [0:37:16]: They're are a B b company.
Dave [0:37:17]: They work with Harry to write these cool ads.
Dave [0:37:20]: Like, that...
Dave [0:37:21]: That's...
Dave [0:37:21]: These don't look like the ads I see in my Linkedin feed.
Dave [0:37:24]: Right?
Dave [0:37:25]: And I think I think that is an interesting example.
Dave [0:37:27]: Is the goal?
Dave [0:37:28]: Like you create this ad and you you guys posted on Linkedin?
Dave [0:37:31]: And that's the ad Or do they actually, like, run these as ads?
Dave [0:37:34]: Is there a distribution?
Dave [0:37:35]: Because I'm like, shit, I want that Calvin ad everywhere?
Dave [0:37:38]: Are they actually doing distribution on this ad too?
Dave [0:37:41]: Or, like, you write these kind fifty things for them, and it is what it is.
Harry [0:37:44]: I think I'm...
Harry [0:37:44]: It's a good question.
Harry [0:37:45]: I think just two things.
Harry [0:37:46]: So short answer is right now none of these ads have ever been in in, like, a mainstream publication.
Harry [0:37:52]: I always ask them, but I talked to mainly the the fans of the company in depth.
Harry [0:37:56]: Probably too busy.
Harry [0:37:57]: They kinda tell me that they might and they end up not being...
Harry [0:38:00]: The second point is perhaps more interesting is, like, these things we're getting, like, five hundred thousand views on Linkedin.
Harry [0:38:05]: I do think that, like, I don't know how many people are reading in the Atlantic.
Harry [0:38:08]: But how Eric put it to me was like, we'll just test it on Linkedin.
Harry [0:38:12]: Three hours later it's on Linkedin.
Harry [0:38:13]: Bam.
Harry [0:38:14]: If it works, let's put it in the Atlantic.
Harry [0:38:15]: He didn't, but that's how they talk.
Harry [0:38:17]: And Think it's a good way of doing is was like idea, social media test.
Harry [0:38:20]: If it's good next.
Michael [0:38:22]: Hi.
Michael [0:38:22]: I'm I'm Michael.
Michael [0:38:23]: That was great.
Michael [0:38:24]: Thank you.
Michael [0:38:24]: So I feel like for the last ten years, everywhere I've been, it's gotten harder and harder and harder to convince leadership that this is something that's worth spending money on early.
Michael [0:38:37]: And spending money and resources on early at a company, especially when you're ten, twenty, thirty employees just to bring someone like you in or to basically take marketing resources and put it towards storytelling, I'm wondering if you have stories, anecdotes, examples, of people that don't have done a really good job of that or any tips or just any thoughts on that?
Michael [0:38:58]: Like, how do do we get that done faster and make that more important to Ceos in particular.
Michael [0:39:03]: To doing this earlier and not waiting till the last minute and then scrambling and realizing we have no story.
Harry [0:39:10]: You you they're too cautious.
Harry [0:39:10]: That's essentially.
Harry [0:39:11]: And you think that leadership...
Harry [0:39:12]: We don't want we're
Michael [0:39:13]: too cautious to...
Michael [0:39:14]: Honestly think that the way I think about it is, they're thinking about, like, their mas hierarchy of needs and they're thinking this is at the top.
Michael [0:39:21]: Right?
Michael [0:39:21]: We're gonna crawl walk run as a company when it comes to our marketing and are coming up with our story, like, our quote unquote story, of us is at the top.
Michael [0:39:30]: Like, that's not not something that we have to worry about right now.
Michael [0:39:32]: It seems like this this squishy feel good story of us.
Michael [0:39:35]: Is really not something we'd figure out.
Harry [0:39:37]: Do you do sales?
Harry [0:39:38]: Does the company do sales?
Harry [0:39:39]: Of course.
Harry [0:39:39]: So April has got a book called sales pitch?
Harry [0:39:42]: Your your story is very similar to your sales pitch.
Harry [0:39:44]: You you get on a call and you've gotta to explain, like why pick you instead of the other alternatives.
Harry [0:39:49]: If the company is doing sales, there will be some sem to the story there.
Harry [0:39:54]: Like, it's not something which just, like, you posted on Linkedin and it exists.
Harry [0:39:58]: No.
Harry [0:39:58]: Like, every single company has one most of them just, like, it's kinda of pretty simple and or it doesn't exist at all.
Harry [0:40:03]: So, like, if you're trying to bring story to into a company.
Harry [0:40:05]: Start with the sales deck.
Harry [0:40:07]: We did that with a coffee thing we did for ramp was like, we gotta change how we talk about and introduced this business.
Harry [0:40:11]: So we we change the sales deck.
Harry [0:40:13]: I think that it's ever present like, any...
Harry [0:40:15]: Any ad you do, either it it says move work forward, and there's no kinda like there's nothing more to it or there is something more to it.
Harry [0:40:23]: Like this is...
Harry [0:40:24]: It's...
Harry [0:40:25]: Your home page should be telling somewhat of a story.
Harry [0:40:27]: Like, it's not something which just doesn't exist.
Harry [0:40:29]: Like, it does exist already.
Harry [0:40:30]: If that made any sense?
Michael [0:40:32]: It does.
Michael [0:40:32]: I I don't like, I like starting with sales.
Michael [0:40:34]: I think that's a great recognition.
Harry [0:40:36]: Okay.
Harry [0:40:36]: Or, like,
Dave [0:40:37]: do the marketing yourself show them ten examples of done ten great companies And be like show me which one of these won without having a good story.
Harry [0:40:44]: Yeah, base company is a really good example.
Harry [0:40:45]: Like, they are punch above their weight by so much in the project management space.
Harry [0:40:50]: There is right.
Harry [0:40:50]: There so many huge huge companies which do the same thing, and these guys are the only profitable one because of how good they are explaining why project management should be simple.
Harry [0:40:59]: Question at the back.
Speaker_9 [0:41:00]: Hey, Eric, that was great.
Speaker_9 [0:41:01]: I've always felt like good copy dies spiked committee when too many people get it.
Speaker_9 [0:41:06]: And they have feedback, it gets sanded it down sanded it down.
Speaker_9 [0:41:09]: How do you avoid that problem?
Harry [0:41:11]: It's a great question.
Harry [0:41:11]: So when I when I do do, how do I avoid the problem??
Harry [0:41:14]: I think there's an ad by David Abbot.
Harry [0:41:17]: Right?
Harry [0:41:17]: And, yeah, I think he pitches this airway it there's a suspended suspended vehicle.
Harry [0:41:22]: He's doing an at for Volvo.
Harry [0:41:23]: And the committees is, like, we can't put a baby underneath the car and add like, yeah.
Harry [0:41:27]: Probably right.
Harry [0:41:28]: Bad idea.
Harry [0:41:29]: Go again.
Harry [0:41:29]: And then the committee says we can't put I guess, like a grandmother or no And Know.
Harry [0:41:34]: It's it's it's of welder underneath the car.
Harry [0:41:36]: And he's, like, the welder that doesn't wanna do it a Bad idea.
Harry [0:41:38]: Abbott alright, whatever.
Harry [0:41:39]: I'll go into the car.
Harry [0:41:41]: And it's...
Harry [0:41:41]: He's needs the right sir, and the her line is something like, if the welding is not strong enough, the car will the car will fall on me.
Harry [0:41:48]: Take matters into your own hands Like, I've always thought, and this is again try to if advice just be too kinda...
Harry [0:41:51]: And you want be too good to be ignored.
Harry [0:41:53]: Like, this is it.
Harry [0:41:54]: I'm gonna live or die by my own ideas.
Harry [0:41:56]: When I work for ramp, they have a really good policy, which is the idea is yours, no one's gonna f fu c k with it.
Harry [0:42:02]: If it goes wrong, it's also on you.
Harry [0:42:03]: And I quite like that as a principle.
Harry [0:42:05]: Like, autonomy, if it goes wrong a buck the stop with you, but that allows someone perhaps like slightly more junior to to take on responsibility.
Harry [0:42:12]: Honestly, used to work as a web developer six years ago for, and they got me doing marketing, and I was shut down.
Harry [0:42:17]: I was s forward.
Harry [0:42:18]: I couldn't break out.
Harry [0:42:19]: It's not easy.
Harry [0:42:19]: I think it's also your a job.
Harry [0:42:21]: There's a lot of Cmos in the audience to like, identify someone who has got it and give them a chance and say, yeah, let's let's run with that.
Derek [0:42:29]: Hey, Eric.
Derek [0:42:29]: My name Derek Sc, and I am really intrigued about that butt so concept.
Derek [0:42:35]: Theoretically, I think it makes a lot of sense at your butts and so.
Derek [0:42:39]: I've actually got some advice to kind of remove those words filler words might might be the term from the actual copy?
Derek [0:42:46]: So with that context, my question is do you have any guidance on how how many times or how often you actually use but and so in the copywriting itself.
Harry [0:42:56]: Great question.
Harry [0:42:56]: I'm really glad you mentioned that because I probably wasn't clear.
Harry [0:42:59]: This stuff's implicit, not explicit, So I'm not saying right between your sentences, but and so I did a whole speech with so many butts and soaps, but I didn't say the words very much.
Harry [0:43:10]: This is more a principle of but changes the direction so advances the story.
Harry [0:43:15]: You're not writing the words.
Harry [0:43:17]: It's just between...
Harry [0:43:18]: It's between the lines.
Harry [0:43:19]: You see that.
Harry [0:43:20]: It's between the lines.
Harry [0:43:20]: It's not in the lines.
Harry [0:43:21]: Great question.
Harry [0:43:23]: Anymore.
Dave [0:43:24]: We got one in the back.
Dave [0:43:25]: Sorry.
Dave [0:43:25]: Back in the cap.
Dave [0:43:26]: Yes.
Dave [0:43:26]: I'm not coming over there.
Dave [0:43:28]: You can shout it out.
Harry [0:43:49]: So it's really a good question.
Harry [0:43:49]: I think the biggest problem is genuinely, and it sounds silly, but I think it's I think it's believing in your own idea.
Harry [0:43:56]: So I think I think creativity is is genuinely far less important than conviction.
Harry [0:44:00]: If you believe in the damn thing, you'll make it...
Harry [0:44:04]: You'll you'll get that it.
Harry [0:44:05]: The problem with Ai, is it kinda gives you a bunch of ideas Honestly, some sometimes they're pretty good, but you actually believe it.
Harry [0:44:10]: The problem with Mark, so Mark, like Mark's long letter.
Harry [0:44:12]: Like, it's the he didn't have the conviction to say anything and you kinda gotta put your your head on the para and be like, we think this And I think it's sorry.
Harry [0:44:22]: It's really...
Harry [0:44:22]: It's like, yeah.
Harry [0:44:23]: Is not gonna do that for you.
Harry [0:44:24]: It's kinda gotta come from within a bit.
Harry [0:44:26]: I think the best use case I've seen for it is I take a homepage, and I say, I drag the writing from the homepage in, and I say to it.
Harry [0:44:34]: Underline or or flag any cliches, abstract verbs, abstract nouns,
Speaker_6 [0:44:40]: and
Harry [0:44:41]: it comes back with a lot of lines, which are not particularly good.
Harry [0:44:43]: I it's very good to identifying what's not very good.
Harry [0:44:45]: To what's not very good is cliche.
Harry [0:44:48]: Like, it's the stuff you hear before.
Harry [0:44:49]: Like, a...
Harry [0:44:50]: If you if you write somebody on a home homepage, it hasn't been said before.
Harry [0:44:52]: Chances are it's it's quite good and the most homepage are not that.
Harry [0:44:56]: Move work forward.
Harry [0:44:57]: That could be any company.
Harry [0:44:58]: So Ai could tell you and it would tell you that move work forward is not very good.
Harry [0:45:02]: I think it would struggle to have the courage to put something there and be like, yeah, This is what we think.
Dave [0:45:08]: Oh, yeah.
Dave [0:45:08]: We got more.
Dave [0:45:08]: I just wanna build on, like, I think the my note was, like, the little exercise on conflict that that was super fun.
Dave [0:45:15]: How often do you do that at work though?
Dave [0:45:18]: Like, never.
Dave [0:45:20]: We all the time.
Dave [0:45:20]: Yes.
Dave [0:45:21]: We don't ever, like, have fun thinking like that, and that is the difference there.
Dave [0:45:25]: Right?
Dave [0:45:25]: And I think, like, okay.
Dave [0:45:27]: Just because it is B2B.
Dave [0:45:28]: The look at all the B b examples fact sharing Hr, finance.
Dave [0:45:32]: Whatever it is.
Dave [0:45:32]: Those are still people, and those still those people still have challenges and problems at work.
Dave [0:45:36]: And so, like, I think the ramp example is a good one.
Dave [0:45:38]: I would love to go back.
Dave [0:45:40]: I'm thinking about, shit We should...
Dave [0:45:41]: We need to fix our website.
Dave [0:45:42]: You know, like, all of the ways you can bring that in there.
Dave [0:45:44]: I love that framework, and I think, we're all getting a lot of the same generic output from Ai, but those are the types of ways.
Dave [0:45:50]: And, you know, when you're around...
Dave [0:45:51]: You...
Dave [0:45:51]: There's a million
Gabe [0:45:52]: different ideas to to r
Dave [0:45:53]: on just just on that.
Dave [0:45:54]: So there's awesome.
Dave [0:45:55]: Yeah.
Dave [0:45:55]: You wanna shout it out?
Harry [0:45:58]: What those space go about right?
Dave [0:46:04]: Oh, you will do that one after.
Dave [0:46:05]: This...
Dave [0:46:05]: Yeah.
Derek [0:46:06]: Yeah.
Derek [0:46:06]: No good.
Derek [0:46:07]: So so special ramp.
Harry [0:46:09]: Cool question Like, I I had no...
Harry [0:46:11]: I didn't wanna work.
Harry [0:46:12]: I don't...
Harry [0:46:13]: I do a few hours a week.
Harry [0:46:14]: Them Right.
Harry [0:46:14]: So I'm not a huge employee, but I do know the guys.
Harry [0:46:16]: They run it quite well.
Harry [0:46:17]: I'll give you the story how they hired me, which kind of answers the question.
Harry [0:46:20]: Just little Arrogant, but, like, kareem the other ceo Him Eric.
Harry [0:46:23]: And they just...
Harry [0:46:24]: He sent up sixteen Dms to me on Twitch and I didn't I didn't reply to any of them because I didn't follow guy.
Harry [0:46:29]: I just kinda came up, and then I get emails from people to the company.
Harry [0:46:31]: We wanna work.
Harry [0:46:32]: You want dead persistent as hell at finding the right people.
Harry [0:46:35]: There's a great piece of advice I got from my friend to a friend George and he says, when you try out works Miguel, don't think how do I do it?
Harry [0:46:41]: Think who?
Harry [0:46:42]: So we're trying to solve a problem.
Harry [0:46:44]: Most people will go on Internet and be like, how do I solve the problem.
Harry [0:46:47]: If it's a big problem, think who?
Harry [0:46:49]: So let's say you're trying to...
Harry [0:46:50]: I don't know, do sales.
Harry [0:46:51]: Right?
Harry [0:46:51]: Who is the best person to solve our sales and you find the person.
Harry [0:46:56]: The second thing on ramp, which is...
Harry [0:46:58]: If anyone knows the company you'll probably know is, they work really quick.
Harry [0:47:01]: So, like, the story when Eric, I sent in the out and he puts it up in two hours.
Harry [0:47:05]: In one it's that's how they do things.
Harry [0:47:07]: Like, they just swing and if they miss, they miss, it's fine, you you move on.
Harry [0:47:10]: They they are fastest hell.
Harry [0:47:12]: And it is...
Harry [0:47:13]: Yeah.
Harry [0:47:13]: Course, Sorry.
Harry [0:47:15]: One more thing.
Harry [0:47:15]: I was there and employee working so hard.
Harry [0:47:17]: And I was shocked.
Harry [0:47:19]: I was like, why are you working so powerful this company babe.
Harry [0:47:21]: Every employee loves the company.
Harry [0:47:22]: They've all equity.
Harry [0:47:23]: And I think there's this little smart thing they they did there where, like, people and the employees are get them paid very well because of equity, and it made me rethink, like, when I joined, they said to me.
Harry [0:47:32]: I said I don't want equity.
Harry [0:47:33]: I just wanna get paid and get out of here.
Harry [0:47:35]: They forced me to have equity.
Harry [0:47:36]: They were like, we actually want you to give a shit, and it kinda worked.
Dave [0:47:42]: Imagine there's another hand over there somewhere elsewhere.
Dave [0:47:44]: No?
Harry [0:47:45]: Sorry.
Harry [0:47:45]: Yeah.
Speaker_5 [0:47:46]: Hi.
Speaker_5 [0:47:46]: I'm try to do that.
Speaker_5 [0:47:47]: Okay.
Speaker_5 [0:47:48]: One if your customer, you're if you're, like, do you need to be this Right?
Speaker_5 [0:47:53]: Is your story for higher product affects customer is amazing.
Speaker_5 [0:47:57]: But your person buying the product perks it that to the customer to connect with that?
Speaker_5 [0:48:05]: How, would you...
Speaker_5 [0:48:07]: I never understand the.
Harry [0:48:09]: Yeah.
Harry [0:48:09]: I could.
Speaker_5 [0:48:10]: It's like the story that's gonna help, like, the person immediately could me with solution with it's, like, the best story which ultimately valve outcome.
Speaker_5 [0:48:18]: Bear free.
Harry [0:48:21]: That's a really good question.
Harry [0:48:22]: I don't have a good answer to be really old.
Harry [0:48:23]: I'll I'm gonna think and...
Harry [0:48:24]: And I'm not sure if anyone in the in the rooms has us experienced that if anyone else is doing B2B and they've come across it.
Harry [0:48:30]: I I don't know.
Harry [0:48:30]: Sorry.
Harry [0:48:31]: I'm gonna think later today.
Harry [0:48:33]: I should say I'm...
Harry [0:48:34]: I'm hanging around like, I'm not hanging around on the.
Harry [0:48:35]: I'm gonna be loving the events for the next couple of days.
Harry [0:48:38]: So hopefully I chat out as many of you as I can, and I'm gonna come back.
Gabe [0:48:45]: Hey.
Gabe [0:48:45]: Thanks for listening to this podcast.
Gabe [0:48:47]: If you like this episode, You know what?
Gabe [0:48:49]: I'm not even gonna ask you to subscribe and leave a review because I don't really care about that.
Gabe [0:48:53]: I have something better for you.
Gabe [0:48:55]: So we've built the number one private community for B marketers.
Gabe [0:48:58]: Exit Five, and you can go and check that out instead of leaving a rating a review, go check it out right now on our website, Exit Five dot com.
Gabe [0:49:06]: Our mission at Exit Five is to help you grow your career in B2B marketing, and there's no better place to do that than with us at at Exit Five.
Gabe [0:49:13]: There's nearly five thousand members now in our community, People are in their posting every day asking questions about things like marketing planning.
Gabe [0:49:21]: Ideas, inspiration, asking questions and getting feedback from your peers, building your own network of marketers who are doing at same thing you are, so you can have a peer group, or maybe just dent about your boss when you need to get in there and get something off your chest.
Gabe [0:49:34]: It's a hundred percent free to join for seven days so you can go and check it out risk free, and then there's a small annual fee to pay if you wanna become a member for the year.
Gabe [0:49:43]: Go check it out, learn more, Exit Five dot com, and I will see you over there in the community.
.png)
.png)
The Exit Five newsletter
Sponsor the exitfive newsletter