Top 5 B2B Webinar Mistakes (and How to Fix Them) with Logan Lyles, DemandShift

Dasha [0:00:01]: You're listening to The Dave Gerhardt Show.

Dasha [0:00:17]: What's up?

Dasha [0:00:17]: It's stop, and the episode that You're about to listen to is my conversation with Logan Lyles.

Dasha [0:00:23]: Logan is the founder of a done for you webinar agency called DemandShift.

Dasha [0:00:29]: You might also recognize Logan's name because he previously won one of our Exit Five live sessions.

Dasha [0:00:36]: I had Logan on the show to talk about what he's learned running webinar programs for his clients.

Dasha [0:00:42]: And we get into the five mistakes that a lot of marketers make when they're running their webinars.

Dasha [0:00:47]: So today, you'll hear us talk about how to reach new audiences, how to get people to book demos with your company before the webinar even happens.

Dasha [0:00:56]: And how to make your follow up after the webinar more useful than just sending the attendees a recording.

Dasha [0:01:03]: So if you or your team have been putting a lot of work into your webinars, but you're not really seeing the pipeline return that you were expecting.

Dasha [0:01:11]: I really hope that you leave this conversation with a few more things to try.

Dasha [0:01:16]: Enjoy the pod?

Dasha [0:01:17]: Alright.

Dasha [0:01:19]: We are live, Logan.

Dasha [0:01:20]: What's up?

Dasha [0:01:21]: Welcome to the pod.

Logan Lyles [0:01:22]: Hey.

Logan Lyles [0:01:22]: Thank you so much for having me.

Logan Lyles [0:01:23]: It was a great time on Exit Five live, probably five, six weeks ago or whatever it was, and I appreciate you guys having me back.

Dasha [0:01:29]: Yes.

Dasha [0:01:29]: If you're listening Logan came on one of the Exit Five lives, and it was dedicated to making great webinars, Logan was the winner pull up your trophy stop job in front of you?

Logan Lyles [0:01:40]: Oh, I got it.

Logan Lyles [0:01:40]: I am displaying this Exit Five live trophy with Pride on my books shelf behind me if you're just listening.

Logan Lyles [0:01:46]: My kids saw it in the mail after Maria and the team sent it to me.

Logan Lyles [0:01:50]: They're like, damn, what the heck is this.

Logan Lyles [0:01:52]: So it took some explaining, but I'm proud of it.

Logan Lyles [0:01:54]: They…

Logan Lyles [0:01:55]: I got a little a few high rolls around the house though because, you know, my family's not as into B2B marketing as most of our families aren't.

Dasha [0:02:02]: Right.

Dasha [0:02:02]: Yes.

Dasha [0:02:02]: No.

Dasha [0:02:03]: But I think it's very cool.

Dasha [0:02:04]: I messaged you right after that webinar was over because the people in the chat were revolt.

Dasha [0:02:08]: If you're not familiar with the Exit Five like blitz format, you get a few minutes to present, it's very fast paced.

Dasha [0:02:16]: You don't get to go super deep But you left the people wanting more.

Dasha [0:02:20]: So I messaged you.

Dasha [0:02:21]: And I said, would you wanna come on the pod and talk about webinars in debts.

Dasha [0:02:24]: And so here you are.

Dasha [0:02:26]: Let's get you introduced, Logan, who are you?

Dasha [0:02:28]: What do you do?

Logan Lyles [0:02:29]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:02:29]: Absolutely.

Logan Lyles [0:02:29]: So Logan Lyles and the founder of DemandShift.

Logan Lyles [0:02:32]: Where a done for you, webinar as a service agency, primarily for B2B brand.

Logan Lyles [0:02:36]: So if you're listening to this and you're a B2c marketer, my webinar mistakes and some of the fixes I found won't necessarily be for you.

Logan Lyles [0:02:43]: But for the last sixteen months, we've been running webinars for dozens of clients, all B2B to B2B a lot in Saas and what we've found are some some key learnings, five common mistakes and we've basically developed a a five part framework that addresses each of those because I'll tell you there's no one silver bullet to solving your webinar woes.

Logan Lyles [0:03:04]: But if you can find these certain dials in these certain areas to fix.

Logan Lyles [0:03:08]: Man, you can…

Logan Lyles [0:03:09]: They add up to some significant improvement to demand gen through webinars in B2b?

Dasha [0:03:16]: I have a soft spot for entrepreneurs, so I just have to ask what made you wanna go out on your own and start a service all around webinars?

Dasha [0:03:22]: Are you a webinar junkie Like, how did this happen?

Logan Lyles [0:03:25]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:03:25]: So most people who know me in the Exit Five community probably know me more as a podcast guy.

Logan Lyles [0:03:30]: I spent four years in the leadership team at a podcast production agency for B2B brands called Swfish.

Logan Lyles [0:03:36]: We actually we're behind the scenes helping Dg g and Dc with seeking wisdom way back in the day, some great B2B podcasts from several years back, like, flip my funnel with Term.

Logan Lyles [0:03:46]: And I kinda bounced around between agency side And in house.

Logan Lyles [0:03:51]: And after I left Sweet fish, I spent two years as an in house marketer at teamwork.com.

Logan Lyles [0:03:56]: And we ran webinars for two years.

Logan Lyles [0:03:59]: And when I looked back at the results, like, we had some indirect influence to pipeline, We were running the the webinars and the podcast, They still get people commenting on the content of the the podcast.

Logan Lyles [0:04:11]: But when I looked at the direct attribution and the direct correlation to demand gen results, I was kind of disappointed.

Logan Lyles [0:04:18]: And so I I started setting about to how could I do this better?

Logan Lyles [0:04:23]: And so after that, I spent about a year at another agency, ran webinars implemented some of the things we're gonna talk about today and webinars became our second leading highest source of new clients.

Logan Lyles [0:04:35]: And I was, like, hey, if this works here, I wonder if it would work for other B2B brand.

Logan Lyles [0:04:41]: Both agencies and brands.

Logan Lyles [0:04:43]: And so far in the last sixteen months, we've driven some really great results.

Logan Lyles [0:04:47]: So It came out of my own failure is long story short of running webinars and not seeing the results that I wanted.

Dasha [0:04:54]: I wouldn't be a marketer or if I didn't ask.

Dasha [0:04:56]: What was the first source of of good leads?

Logan Lyles [0:04:59]: Oh, it was referrals.

Logan Lyles [0:05:00]: You know, if you're if you're in an agency, like, word mouth, you know, referrals are gonna be pretty hard to beat.

Logan Lyles [0:05:06]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:05:07]: But right now, you know, it's been working on the other side for the in house marketers, like, we just ran a webinar for one of our clients, and we had about two hundred and fifty sign ups, and they booked thirty demos.

Logan Lyles [0:05:18]: So that's over a ten percent conversion rate, and from the survey that we ran earlier this year across B2B marketing teams.

Logan Lyles [0:05:26]: Most teams one aren't tracking, what's their conversion to demo or booked call from webinar sign ups.

Logan Lyles [0:05:32]: And if they are, it's more around two percent.

Logan Lyles [0:05:34]: So seeing that above ten percent has been really cool.

Dasha [0:05:38]: That's awesome.

Dasha [0:05:38]: I mean, Mean, There's no, like, real good way of increasing referrals.

Dasha [0:05:43]: Like, if your CEO comes to you as a marketer and he's…

Dasha [0:05:46]: Or she is like, hey, referrals are the number one source of pipeline for us How do you even get more referrals.

Dasha [0:05:50]: I think referrals is one of those things we're if you have a good service or a good product, you're gonna get more referrals, but it's not one that you can really scale whereas webinars, like, it's it's a scalable source.

Dasha [0:06:00]: So what I'm hearing is that at the company that you were at, it was the number one actually scalable channel for you guys.

Dasha [0:06:07]: Which is awesome.

Logan Lyles [0:06:08]: I appreciate that credit there.

Logan Lyles [0:06:09]: Yeah I'll take that.

Logan Lyles [0:06:10]: That's…

Dasha [0:06:11]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:06:11]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:06:11]: I'm a marketer.

Dasha [0:06:12]: Okay.

Dasha [0:06:13]: Today, what does your typical client look like?

Dasha [0:06:16]: Like, b2b to B2B Saas?

Dasha [0:06:17]: What team size?

Dasha [0:06:18]: How many webinars are are they running a year?

Dasha [0:06:20]: Do they already have a webinar when they when they find you, tell me a little bit about that.

Logan Lyles [0:06:25]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:06:25]: So we've worked with both.

Logan Lyles [0:06:26]: We've worked with B2B brands that have existing webinar series, those that have maybe started, and it kind of fought for them, and they thought about restarting it.

Logan Lyles [0:06:35]: A lot of our clients over the last year and a half have been very in in team size from kind of early stage to more mid market.

Logan Lyles [0:06:43]: But I would say, oftentimes they're kind of small teams of, you know, up to maybe five fewer than ten usually marketers that have a lot on their plate or are stretched then, have a lot of demands?

Logan Lyles [0:06:55]: Hey, what are we doing about Ae.

Logan Lyles [0:06:57]: What are we doing with?

Logan Lyles [0:06:58]: Podcasting?

Logan Lyles [0:06:59]: What are we doing with Linkedin?

Logan Lyles [0:07:00]: You know, the CEO wants to post on Linkedin?

Logan Lyles [0:07:02]: Or are you trying to talk them into it?

Logan Lyles [0:07:04]: Like, just Cook did over a vector, and they're looking to get kind of more juice for the squeeze from a channel, and that's what we've been focused on helping them do is increase that conversion rate from webinar sign ups.

Logan Lyles [0:07:17]: To whatever that next step is.

Logan Lyles [0:07:19]: Whether that's a sales call, a demo, a free trial or whatever.

Logan Lyles [0:07:22]: And also have the webinar feed other things again, to get more juice for the squeeze.

Logan Lyles [0:07:27]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:07:28]: Like, I have one client where we looked at one of our top performing webinars, and it was five steps to showing up an Ai search.

Logan Lyles [0:07:35]: We're like, well, repurposing webinar doesn't have to be just grabbing clips out of it.

Logan Lyles [0:07:40]: Let's turn this into its own lead magnet because this could turn into an interactive template.

Logan Lyles [0:07:44]: Those sorts of things, and that's, you know, just kind of one of the ways and we'll get into that in one of the the mistakes a little later on.

Dasha [0:07:52]: Let's get into it.

Dasha [0:07:53]: Okay.

Dasha [0:07:53]: So you work with so many clients, and you mentioned, you know, there's five mistakes that you see a lot of teams may.

Dasha [0:08:00]: Let's go through all five and deep dive each one.

Logan Lyles [0:08:05]: So first is only promoting to your own list.

Logan Lyles [0:08:08]: The second is having what I call a dead end sign up flow.

Logan Lyles [0:08:11]: That's kinda what we talked about on Exit Five live, The third is not having a clear next step during the the live show.

Logan Lyles [0:08:19]: Mistake number four is only splitting your follow up into attended or not attended, which really isn't segmenting the that audience very well.

Logan Lyles [0:08:28]: And then mistake number five is letting the webinar end when it ends.

Logan Lyles [0:08:32]: So that kinda touches on that.

Logan Lyles [0:08:34]: It's different repurposing playbook that you can run as we we talked about earlier.

Logan Lyles [0:08:38]: So let's dive in into number one, only promoting it to your own list.

Logan Lyles [0:08:41]: Now I understand why a lot of people are doing this.

Logan Lyles [0:08:44]: They're kinda going with the tried and true thing.

Logan Lyles [0:08:47]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:08:47]: Email is actually across all the data we see, the number one channel to Drive webinar sign ups and registrations.

Logan Lyles [0:08:54]: Over organic social, over paid social over any other channel email is consistently the number one performer.

Logan Lyles [0:09:02]: However, if you're looking for a webinar to Drive new leads and you're only emailing your own list, well one, you're gonna kinda burn them out, and two, you're not really reaching any new audience.

Logan Lyles [0:09:13]: And I'd say the other thing that I see a lot of people doing is they post on social about it, but they're not looking at any other creative ways like, hey, this post actually took off.

Logan Lyles [0:09:23]: Can we boost it as a thought leader ad.

Logan Lyles [0:09:25]: What if we list the event as a Linkedin event on our company page, not just do a straight post about it.

Logan Lyles [0:09:31]: So I've actually found that email and social do work really well.

Logan Lyles [0:09:35]: But in each of those buckets, they're kind of, like, three or four other plays that people typically aren't running and we can get into some of those, but I'll pause and see kinda what questions you have for me and kind of the outset there.

Logan Lyles [0:09:47]: Dash.

Dasha [0:09:48]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:09:48]: I wanna know what we can…

Dasha [0:09:49]: Like, I am guilty, I think of all five mistakes.

Dasha [0:09:52]: No this one…

Dasha [0:09:53]: Included, but you're point about blasting your own audience, Like, that audience is already familiar with you.

Dasha [0:10:00]: That's why they're in a nurture newsletter kind of audience.

Dasha [0:10:03]: So it makes sense.

Dasha [0:10:04]: But, yeah.

Dasha [0:10:05]: I mean, tell us what should we do differently.

Dasha [0:10:08]: What are the untapped ways of driving webinar attendees.

Dasha [0:10:11]: Because when you're doing a webinar, I think for our team, for example, we'll spend so much time putting together the content for it, but then you actually have to do the second part, which is very hard, which is getting butts and seats.

Dasha [0:10:22]: So, yeah, I'm very interested in what you to say are

Logan Lyles [0:10:25]: webinar Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:10:26]: And I'd love to hear a little bit about, like, a peek behind the curtain at how you guys are running at five live and any of the things that I shared that you guys are already doing or things that I've left off my list because you guys run great webinars as we talked about in the open of this episode.

Logan Lyles [0:10:39]: So one, I would say email, let's talk about email first and some other things you can do there, and then we'll talk about social and some other tactics you can run there.

Logan Lyles [0:10:47]: So email, one of the most effective things I've done lately, and this is great, especially for kind of small scrappy brands where you might not have a lot of paid budget to be able to put behind the webinar is find partners, find industry influencers, find people with not a massive email list, but They've got a decent sized list at least around the size of your database, and it overlaps with your Ic.

Logan Lyles [0:11:13]: And approach them and just say, hey, you guys wanna do, like, an email swap.

Logan Lyles [0:11:17]: And basically, the way I've done that is, you know, I might come you Josh and say, hey, Exit Five, you guys have a great newsletter, what if in the next iteration of the DemandShift newsletter, I promote Exit Five live, you guys promote my webinar to your newsletter list.

Logan Lyles [0:11:32]: And I've done a few of those with no extra spend, just a little bit of back and forth in Linkedin Dms or emails with folks.

Logan Lyles [0:11:39]: And it's been really, really effective because it's kind of a win win.

Logan Lyles [0:11:43]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:11:44]: If you both have similar email sized lists it's kind of, you know, it's no big ask on anyone.

Logan Lyles [0:11:49]: You get to promote something to your list that has nothing to do with you, so you get to kinda just add value no strings attached, and you get access to someone else's audience on a channel, that is the highest converting channel for driving webinar regis.

Logan Lyles [0:12:02]: So I really really like that play.

Logan Lyles [0:12:05]: It can take a little work to find those right partnerships, but I would say, you know, look at the people you're connected with on Linkedin.

Logan Lyles [0:12:11]: Look at your partners, look at maybe your your board, who are they connected with in the industry who are maybe some of the creators in your space on Linkedin that you could approach something along those lines.

Logan Lyles [0:12:22]: And then that kinda leads naturally to the second play that's worked well with email.

Logan Lyles [0:12:27]: If you do have some budget is finding newsletters that already have an existing sponsorship model and just say, hey, what would it cost to run an add?

Logan Lyles [0:12:35]: Because you'll often stand out because most people in b2b B2B who are buying newsletter ads it's a direct call to action.

Logan Lyles [0:12:41]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:12:41]: It's book a demo.

Logan Lyles [0:12:42]: It's try out our product.

Logan Lyles [0:12:44]: It's start a trial.

Logan Lyles [0:12:45]: And you stand out just offering content and offering webinars, you might actually see higher conversions and and better return on that spend.

Logan Lyles [0:12:54]: And if you do what we talk about here in a few minutes with the two step sign up flow.

Logan Lyles [0:12:58]: It might actually lead to some of those direct conversions even though you kind of bury that leads.

Logan Lyles [0:13:02]: So those are some thoughts on email curious how that channel has worked for you guys lately with your own webinars at Exit Five.

Dasha [0:13:09]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:13:09]: I think when it comes to Exit Five, Maria and Marissa on our team run that, and they do a phenomenal job.

Dasha [0:13:16]: So when I say that I have made some of these mistakes, I'm talking about, So I'm the VP of marketing at a company called Proton Ai.

Dasha [0:13:22]: And I host this show as well.

Dasha [0:13:25]: So our process there is different than the Exit Five.

Dasha [0:13:29]: At Exit Five.

Dasha [0:13:29]: It is like, a full on production.

Logan Lyles [0:13:32]: It is.

Logan Lyles [0:13:32]: I can tell you guys for sure.

Dasha [0:13:34]: It's a full on production.

Dasha [0:13:34]: I mean, you know you participated in the the Exit Five live.

Dasha [0:13:37]: The webinar is being promoted across a number of channels that content is getting repurposed.

Dasha [0:13:42]: For example, like, this podcast, we're gonna sit down and we're gonna record and then a few weeks from now, a newsletter will go out, and we will repurpose some of the package some of your wisdom from the show, and it's gonna go out to the Exit Five newsletter, some people are gonna wanna, you know, engage with you and ask you more questions.

Dasha [0:14:00]: And guess what, you're in the Exit Five community.

Dasha [0:14:02]: So it's like a flywheel.

Dasha [0:14:04]: Exit Five is just done such a such a great job, and shout out to Marissa and Maria who run the the show there.

Dasha [0:14:10]: They do such a great job.

Dasha [0:14:12]: A few questions for you.

Dasha [0:14:14]: So one question on the swap very rarely will you find someone that has, like, literally the exact same subscriber count as you.

Dasha [0:14:22]: So what do you do when you're…

Dasha [0:14:25]: Let's say you're, like, the small fish and you're approaching a much larger newsletter, and you wanna do a swap.

Dasha [0:14:31]: But it's not like a fair trade.

Dasha [0:14:33]: Like, let's say I have ten thousand subs in this other company has fifty.

Dasha [0:14:36]: For us to cross promote.

Dasha [0:14:38]: It's not exactly the same thing.

Dasha [0:14:39]: Any suggestions there.

Logan Lyles [0:14:42]: I actually had this come up just a few weeks ago.

Logan Lyles [0:14:44]: I approached another company with probably about forty or fifty thousand subs on their email list.

Logan Lyles [0:14:51]: We've got about six k DemandShift.

Logan Lyles [0:14:53]: And I was like, look, this isn't gonna be an even trade, but I noticed you guys have a few things going on.

Logan Lyles [0:14:59]: The founder just released a book.

Logan Lyles [0:15:01]: You guys have this event coming up, and you guys haven't been super active on Linkedin lately.

Logan Lyles [0:15:06]: So what if I email the list once about the book, once about your upcoming event, and maybe I could host a quick Linkedin live, like, Ama style with the founder.

Logan Lyles [0:15:16]: And so it's all about, like, where do you have some leverage?

Logan Lyles [0:15:20]: Maybe you have a little bit more time.

Logan Lyles [0:15:21]: Maybe you have not as big an email list, but you've got a bigger following on Linkedin, or they have something that they're really trying to promote, hey, we could host you on the podcast because you've got a podcast and you need guess anyway, and you could do them a favor and kind of plug it there.

Logan Lyles [0:15:35]: So look for those other areas because the value doesn't have to be just subscriber count and send, you can find some other ways that are appealing to them.

Dasha [0:15:43]: I love that.

Dasha [0:15:44]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:15:44]: Find something that the other company doesn't have.

Dasha [0:15:46]: And time is one of those things.

Dasha [0:15:48]: The other question I have that I I think you might know.

Dasha [0:15:51]: Maybe not what.

Dasha [0:15:51]: If you're looking for a newsletter to sponsor?

Dasha [0:15:54]: Is there like, a marketplace of some sort where you…

Dasha [0:15:57]: As a marketer can find, like, a newsletter that pairs well with the audience that you're trying to capture.

Logan Lyles [0:16:03]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:16:03]: One, I haven't found anything that's just great for this yet.

Logan Lyles [0:16:06]: I'm thinking about can I, like, vibe coded tool and start collecting people see if I get this sort of response, like, with your slack community on vibe coding that kinda took off a few weeks ago?

Logan Lyles [0:16:16]: The closest thing I found is a company called paved.

Logan Lyles [0:16:19]: I think it's just p a v e d dot com, and they have a variety of newsletters and kind of like a newsletter marketplace that you can search based on your ic c, your niche.

Logan Lyles [0:16:28]: So that's the closest thing I've found so far.

Dasha [0:16:31]: Sweet.

Dasha [0:16:31]: Cool.

Dasha [0:16:32]: Okay.

Dasha [0:16:33]: What next?

Dasha [0:16:34]: Should we talk about?

Logan Lyles [0:16:35]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:16:35]: I would say the other thing just real quick, a couple of our secret sauce and some of our tactics that not a lot of people are doing is with Linkedin.

Logan Lyles [0:16:44]: So just to talk about the social bucket, one more a little bit more on this mistake one in promo tactics that don't actually work.

Logan Lyles [0:16:50]: List your webinar as a Linkedin event on your company page, add your speakers as speakers, and a lot of people don't realize this if once you get added as a speaker and you go to that event page on Linkedin, you can hit share and instead of hitting, like post or Dm people.

Logan Lyles [0:17:06]: There's an invite button.

Logan Lyles [0:17:07]: And what that does is allow you…

Logan Lyles [0:17:09]: It pulls up all your first degree connections.

Logan Lyles [0:17:11]: You can even filter it by Geo, by industry.

Logan Lyles [0:17:14]: I wish you could filter by, like, company size and a few other things, but it's pretty decent.

Logan Lyles [0:17:18]: And you can send up to a thousand invites a week per speaker to your event.

Logan Lyles [0:17:23]: Now, Pick, do you wanna go volume?

Logan Lyles [0:17:25]: Do you wanna go more quality with this, but It basically shows up Like, if I sent one to you u dash, it would be, like, hey Logan is inviting you to this webinar thirty Ai agents, what we learned the hard way, which is one we're we're hosting in week or so.

Logan Lyles [0:17:38]: And you'd have a little x a little check.

Logan Lyles [0:17:40]: Just like a a connection request.

Logan Lyles [0:17:42]: Mh.

Logan Lyles [0:17:43]: But it's an event invite that doesn't show up as a Dm.

Logan Lyles [0:17:45]: So it kinda shows up differently.

Logan Lyles [0:17:47]: So that's one hack I got for my buddy, Justin Row over it impeccable.

Logan Lyles [0:17:50]: And then the second is, look at what organic posts are performing well, promote those as thought later ads.

Logan Lyles [0:17:56]: And if you put the link in the comment on the organic post, move that to the body of the actual post before you promote it, because now you're paying for reach, that link in the post isn't gonna hurt your reach anyway.

Logan Lyles [0:18:09]: And promote that as a thought leader ad.

Logan Lyles [0:18:12]: We've seen that work really, really well in some campaigns too.

Logan Lyles [0:18:14]: So that's it for mistake One.

Dasha [0:18:17]: We do that with our thought leader ads in general before we…

Dasha [0:18:20]: I think it's a great strategy.

Dasha [0:18:21]: It's worked really well for us even outside of, like, webinar stuff.

Dasha [0:18:25]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:18:25]: Just…

Dasha [0:18:25]: You have a post that does really well whether it's your CEO's page or someone else on the leadership team, It pops off.

Dasha [0:18:31]: The link doesn't exist in the body because the reason it popped off is because it wasn't promoting anything, and then we boost it, and then we add a call to action link at the end.

Dasha [0:18:40]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:18:40]: That's great.

Dasha [0:18:41]: Okay.

Dasha [0:18:42]: The second mistake, one that might be familiar if you joined the Exit Five live, but we're gonna go deeper this time.

Dasha [0:18:48]: So take it away.

Logan Lyles [0:18:50]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:18:50]: So the mistake is having a dead end sign up flow.

Logan Lyles [0:18:54]: And what really kind of dawned on me a while back as I was kind of…

Logan Lyles [0:18:58]: Like I said, kind of revisiting my webinar playbook was that only about thirty five percent of people who sign up for your webinar come to the live show.

Logan Lyles [0:19:05]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:19:05]: But a hundred percent of people see your thank page.

Logan Lyles [0:19:09]: They fill out, you know, name and email or whatever you have on your webinar sign up form, and they get a thank you message where they get redirected to a Thank you page And like I said, a hundred percent of people are seeing that.

Logan Lyles [0:19:20]: Where don't we love a hundred percent as marketers.

Logan Lyles [0:19:22]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:19:22]: Dash.

Logan Lyles [0:19:23]: But we're doing nothing with that.

Logan Lyles [0:19:25]: And if you think about it, I don't know if you're like me.

Logan Lyles [0:19:27]: But when I sign up for a webinar, I rarely look honestly at what day or time it is.

Logan Lyles [0:19:31]: If I'm interested in the topic, I just sign up, I know it'll go on my calendar.

Logan Lyles [0:19:34]: I'll go if I can make it.

Logan Lyles [0:19:36]: And if it's high enough priority for me.

Logan Lyles [0:19:37]: And if not, I'll get the recording.

Logan Lyles [0:19:39]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:19:39]: And so that's why only about thirty five percent of people show up live.

Logan Lyles [0:19:43]: But when we think about it, that's their most high intent moment.

Logan Lyles [0:19:46]: They are saying this is for me.

Logan Lyles [0:19:48]: You're talking about a a topic that I care about, I think you can help educate me on this, and it's at least enough for me to give you my email and maybe an hour of my time.

Logan Lyles [0:19:57]: And so what I started thinking about is what can we do with that a thank you page instead.

Logan Lyles [0:20:03]: And what we've done now is implemented what we call our two steps sign up flow.

Logan Lyles [0:20:07]: So someone will fill out a form on the landing page for the webinar.

Logan Lyles [0:20:10]: And instead of getting a thank you message, they'll get the start to a brief survey Of, usually, like five to six questions.

Logan Lyles [0:20:17]: And what that survey is designed to do is to get more first party data from your audience, which can help influence the content that you create, It can also qualify them and see what sort of quality of leads are you getting, especially if you're a small team and you don't have a big budget for enrichment, and you wanna see, you know, get some first party data.

Logan Lyles [0:20:36]: What's the size of your team.

Logan Lyles [0:20:37]: How many marketers are on your team or how many people are on your It team, if that's who you sell to, whatever the case is.

Logan Lyles [0:20:42]: And then the third thing it can do is kind of ag the pain that they're feeling and put an offer in front of them to take a next step.

Logan Lyles [0:20:50]: And so I mentioned at the top of the episode where we had a client who booked about thirty demos on a webinar that didn't have a thousand regis it had less than two hundred and fifty.

Logan Lyles [0:20:59]: Two thirds of those, I think booked those demos before the webinar even happened because they went through that two step sign up flow.

Logan Lyles [0:21:08]: We put an offer in front of them, and they decided, hey, let's go ahead and do this now.

Logan Lyles [0:21:12]: Because like I said, you have that momentum.

Logan Lyles [0:21:13]: You have that intent.

Logan Lyles [0:21:14]: They're leaning forward.

Logan Lyles [0:21:15]: And putting a survey in place of that, thank you page can lead to some pretty cool results.

Logan Lyles [0:21:20]: I've had a lot of people ask, like, hey, logan, are my registration gonna fall off.

Logan Lyles [0:21:25]: And after running this for the last sixteen months, the percentage of completion of this survey has helped really steady at about ninety percent, which originally, I was like, I can't believe this.

Logan Lyles [0:21:36]: And I've had clients say, I I don't know if we believe you, Logan.

Logan Lyles [0:21:38]: And even though you've been talking about this, let's see.

Logan Lyles [0:21:41]: And then I one client it came in at, like, eighty nine point five percent.

Logan Lyles [0:21:44]: And I was like, well, dang.

Logan Lyles [0:21:45]: We missed the ninety percent, but I hope y'all believe me now.

Dasha [0:21:48]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:21:48]: That's insane.

Dasha [0:21:49]: I was just gonna ask how many people actually take the time to fill this out on the on the page.

Dasha [0:21:54]: So I think you brought an example.

Dasha [0:21:56]: Show us what this can look like in practice.

Dasha [0:21:58]: Because I think this is, like such a no brainer hack.

Dasha [0:22:01]: It doesn't take that much time, and you're collecting valuable information, and those people might not show up to the webinars.

Dasha [0:22:07]: So you gotta get them all their high.

Logan Lyles [0:22:09]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:22:09]: Exactly.

Logan Lyles [0:22:10]: So let me let me show you here real quick.

Logan Lyles [0:22:12]: We got a landing page here.

Logan Lyles [0:22:14]: Typical stuff, big form, just first last name and email.

Logan Lyles [0:22:18]: That's all we need.

Logan Lyles [0:22:19]: But you can see the second step in my funnel is not a thank page.

Logan Lyles [0:22:22]: It's this survey.

Logan Lyles [0:22:23]: So the first thing to know is that we kind of frame this as, like, a continuation of the registration process.

Logan Lyles [0:22:31]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:22:31]: And so I don't necessarily ask them like, hey.

Logan Lyles [0:22:33]: Do you wanna complete a quick survey?

Logan Lyles [0:22:35]: We just say, hey complete your free webinar registration by answering a few questions here.

Logan Lyles [0:22:40]: If you're watching, you can see, I have a hidden field here for email, and that's important.

Logan Lyles [0:22:45]: I call this a two step sign up flow because, you know, as marketers, it's like, short form more conversions, longer form fewer conversions, but you get more info out of them.

Logan Lyles [0:22:55]: By separating this into two steps where the moment that they fill out that first form, they're actually registered and we'll get to the webinar, they just won't get the additional offer, but you pass their email over to the second page and into the survey.

Logan Lyles [0:23:08]: That way, your Crm is recognizing them and you don't have to say, well, what's your email again so it ties on their responses to the right person.

Logan Lyles [0:23:16]: The next thing I like to do is ask some really easy.

Logan Lyles [0:23:19]: So, like, where are you located?

Logan Lyles [0:23:20]: Boom, just, like, multiple choice.

Logan Lyles [0:23:22]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:23:23]: What best describes you, I run a company.

Logan Lyles [0:23:25]: I work in a company because if they say I run a company.

Logan Lyles [0:23:28]: I'm actually gonna skip the job title question?

Logan Lyles [0:23:30]: Because I think it's founder it's cares.

Logan Lyles [0:23:32]: Something like that that I could just automate.

Logan Lyles [0:23:34]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:23:34]: Another one that's good for just kind of lead scoring and stuff, but it's an easy question to ask how many people work at your company.

Logan Lyles [0:23:40]: Could you get this from enrichment?

Logan Lyles [0:23:41]: Maybe.

Logan Lyles [0:23:42]: And if you have that enrichment tool, then maybe skip this question.

Logan Lyles [0:23:45]: Don't ask any questions you're not gonna use that aren't gonna help you in some form of fashion.

Logan Lyles [0:23:50]: Now this is where it gets interesting.

Logan Lyles [0:23:52]: You don't have to start this complex, but with this client's survey, we actually have two paths to go down because like I said earlier, I think I mentioned this client, Vista is an Ae g platform.

Logan Lyles [0:24:04]: And so you as you can imagine, everybody's talking about Ai both in house marketers and agencies.

Logan Lyles [0:24:08]: So we actually ask a different set of questions if they say they're an agency.

Logan Lyles [0:24:12]: We take them down a different path of of questioning versus they pick another industry.

Logan Lyles [0:24:16]: We know they're an in house marketer.

Logan Lyles [0:24:18]: If they're an in house marketer, how many people work on your marketing team?

Logan Lyles [0:24:21]: And then here's where we get to some of those pain agitation questions.

Logan Lyles [0:24:24]: How confident are you that your brand shows up when buyers ask L about your category when it comes to Ai search?

Logan Lyles [0:24:30]: Which area feels like your biggest gap.

Logan Lyles [0:24:32]: So…

Logan Lyles [0:24:33]: But when we ask those questions, and then they get to the end, and they get this question unless they've been disqualified.

Logan Lyles [0:24:40]: Based on your answers, you qualify for a free forty page customized Ge plan tailored to your brand's current status in Ai search.

Logan Lyles [0:24:48]: Would you like to schedule a quick call to get your free Geo plan.

Logan Lyles [0:24:51]: And so this is a way, if they say yes, again, we don't put them on a dead in.

Logan Lyles [0:24:56]: We don't say, hey, we'll follow up because we know speed lead is so important.

Logan Lyles [0:25:00]: So if they hit yes, They actually go to the very next page, which actually, I didn't even think about.

Logan Lyles [0:25:05]: I can show you guys as well.

Logan Lyles [0:25:06]: Let's go to the schedule a meeting page, which is the next step that they would go to and boom, they're able to schedule that demo with the enhanced offer of getting the free plan right away, and they can take that action.

Logan Lyles [0:25:20]: So you can see how in these couple of steps, we're taking advantage, we're leveraging that high intent moment.

Logan Lyles [0:25:26]: Pro tip here, don't them off on a calendar or Hubspot meeting page where the name of the event doesn't match the the intent, the offer from that question during the survey.

Logan Lyles [0:25:38]: So you can see how this the name here, get your customized Ge strategy in minutes.

Logan Lyles [0:25:42]: Matches what the offer was in the question.

Logan Lyles [0:25:45]: Because as with everything in marketing other than a I think you page.

Logan Lyles [0:25:48]: Nothing's a hundred percent.

Logan Lyles [0:25:49]: So you'll get people who say yes, but not book.

Logan Lyles [0:25:51]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:25:52]: And so what you wanna do is reinforce what they said yes to with the title as well as the, like, what you'll get bullets here on that page.

Logan Lyles [0:25:59]: So, yeah, that's kind of what of a real live example in B2B Saas looks like.

Logan Lyles [0:26:03]: We've been doing this for over six months for this client with some really good results.

Dasha [0:26:09]: This is brilliant.

Dasha [0:26:09]: At first when you said the thirty meetings.

Dasha [0:26:11]: I was, like, how, but it makes so much sense, and I feel like this is a pretty low lift thing, Like, I'm loving this.

Dasha [0:26:17]: Thank you for coming so prepared.

Dasha [0:26:18]: This is amazing.

Logan Lyles [0:26:20]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:26:20]: And I think that I saw…

Logan Lyles [0:26:22]: Got tagged in a post yesterday on Linkedin where someone had attended the Exit Five live that we talked about earlier.

Logan Lyles [0:26:29]: And small marketing team, they're, like, we'd soft if we could kind of cobb this together.

Logan Lyles [0:26:33]: We were hesitant.

Logan Lyles [0:26:34]: And I think she said it was maybe, like, seventy five or eighty percent of people completed the survey.

Logan Lyles [0:26:39]: I don't know if they had, like, the calendar booking option built in as the third step, but that was really encouraging to me.

Logan Lyles [0:26:46]: Like you said that A lot of teams…

Logan Lyles [0:26:48]: It's not Rocket science, but it's very doable for even some small marketing teams that might be listening to this.

Dasha [0:26:54]: Totally.

Dasha [0:26:54]: Well, especially with Ai now too.

Dasha [0:26:56]: Like, you can…

Dasha [0:26:56]: I don't know if feed at the transcript from this podcast and say, I wanna do this walk me through how to do it.

Dasha [0:27:01]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:27:01]: Now is the time Now is the time, especially if you're already running webinars.

Dasha [0:27:05]: It's, like, one extra of two extra steps.

Dasha [0:27:07]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:27:08]: Alright.

Dasha [0:27:08]: Let's do mistake number three.

Logan Lyles [0:27:11]: Alright.

Logan Lyles [0:27:11]: Mistake number three is having a live show with no clear next step, and I was way guilty of this you guys.

Logan Lyles [0:27:17]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:27:18]: I've heard this.

Logan Lyles [0:27:19]: I think it's an old Irish bra that says for every mile of road, there are two miles of ditch.

Logan Lyles [0:27:24]: And that's so that means that, like, wherever you are, there's two potential mistakes you can make.

Logan Lyles [0:27:28]: You can veer over into the ditch on the right, or you can veer over into the ditch in the left.

Logan Lyles [0:27:32]: And I think for marketers, correct me if I'm wrong if you feel this way it?

Logan Lyles [0:27:35]: I feel like one dish is we get way to sales y.

Logan Lyles [0:27:39]: We just blast people, we're going around trying to hug strangers saying, do you wanna demo them?

Logan Lyles [0:27:43]: Do wanna demo?

Logan Lyles [0:27:43]: Do you wanna demo and they've never met our brand before.

Logan Lyles [0:27:45]: The other ditch is, we're just broadly educating people so much that it's not tied to the problem that we solve and we're not being clear about if you do want help.

Logan Lyles [0:27:56]: If you are in that five percent that's in market in my Ic right now what the heck do I do.

Logan Lyles [0:28:01]: For me, I've veer way off into that second ditch, which led to some great brand building, But like I said, the demand gen results weren't necessarily there.

Logan Lyles [0:28:11]: And so I think about it this way, one, you want your webinar, to do one of two things.

Logan Lyles [0:28:18]: It should educate people in a way that shows them exactly how to do the thing that your product can do.

Logan Lyles [0:28:25]: But then you say, well, we've shown you in the last hour exactly how to do this thing.

Logan Lyles [0:28:30]: If you wanna do it, it's gonna take you apps amount of hours.

Logan Lyles [0:28:33]: If you use our product, we built it using this framework to help accelerate things and instead of taking forty hours, it's gonna take forty five minutes.

Logan Lyles [0:28:41]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:28:41]: And so you're holding true to that educational promise that you made, but you're giving people two options.

Logan Lyles [0:28:48]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:28:48]: The second thing it could do, which is similar, but a little bit different is it should solve a problem, but then uncover another problem that is, like, the next step in the process that your product solves.

Logan Lyles [0:29:02]: And so an example might be well with with Ai search.

Logan Lyles [0:29:07]: Let's take that as an example.

Logan Lyles [0:29:09]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:29:09]: Like, we've shown you how to find out where your brand is showing up in Ai search.

Logan Lyles [0:29:14]: Here's how you prompt the models.

Logan Lyles [0:29:16]: Here's the prompts you should look at.

Logan Lyles [0:29:18]: Here's how you do it in Claude dah.

Logan Lyles [0:29:19]: Well, after that, now you're gonna have a strategy, who's gonna execute it?

Logan Lyles [0:29:24]: Do you have time to do the execution.

Logan Lyles [0:29:26]: Well, that's where a product like, Say This comes in and that sort to keep kind of using them as an example.

Logan Lyles [0:29:31]: So I think one of those either, like, here's how you do it and give them the Diy or the done for you solution with your product or service, or we taught you how to do this thing The next thing is actually maybe a little harder.

Logan Lyles [0:29:42]: And if you wanna fast track those results, our product can step in for you.

Logan Lyles [0:29:46]: So I think that's the first part, and then it's about how do you frame that offer in the right part during the live show.

Logan Lyles [0:29:53]: But curious, your thoughts on kind of those two stitches and two ways to avoid the stitches that I was talking about there?

Dasha [0:29:59]: The two ditch stitches resonate so hard.

Dasha [0:30:00]: I think as a marketer, you worked told, don't be too sales y.

Dasha [0:30:05]: And so you end up in the Okay.

Dasha [0:30:07]: I'm educating.

Dasha [0:30:08]: I'm educating.

Dasha [0:30:08]: I'm educating.

Dasha [0:30:09]: I'm never actually calling into action.

Dasha [0:30:11]: So, yeah, Definitely resonates.

Dasha [0:30:12]: And I think your…

Dasha [0:30:15]: I, you're literally living at.

Dasha [0:30:16]: You're…

Dasha [0:30:17]: You've come on a podcast.

Dasha [0:30:17]: You're giving away kind of all the all the secrets you're giving us the secrets sauce to running our own webinar It doesn't mean that every marketer has capacity to go and implement all of this stuff.

Dasha [0:30:27]: Even with Ai.

Dasha [0:30:28]: We are dealing with this right now with ad creative.

Dasha [0:30:30]: We send goodbye to our creative agency.

Dasha [0:30:34]: We brought paid in house.

Dasha [0:30:35]: And guess what our in house demand gen person is so busy, and he's saying dash, like, I've become a bottleneck.

Dasha [0:30:42]: We need to update our creative.

Dasha [0:30:43]: And, yes, I can say, okay.

Dasha [0:30:46]: Well, what about Ai, like, plug eye into Higgs field, but someone still has to, like, sit down in front of a computer with Ai, plug in Higgs field come up with a creative idea and create all of those, and he just does not have the time because he's also doing partnerships and all this other stuff.

Dasha [0:31:00]: So I love the idea of giving someone kind of an off ramp to, like, take everything they learn and just let you do it if they don't wanna do it themselves.

Logan Lyles [0:31:08]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:31:08]: The way I've kinda of framed it, and I've…

Logan Lyles [0:31:10]: Y'all feel free to steal this is I almost frame it as, like, not take a next step or not.

Logan Lyles [0:31:15]: Like, I kinda lay out three paths for folks.

Logan Lyles [0:31:18]: I say, hey, we've been talking through this stuff for last forty five minutes.

Logan Lyles [0:31:21]: You hopefully, you've learned some things.

Logan Lyles [0:31:23]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:31:23]: Hit thumbs up in the chat if you've learned some things, kinda get everybody's attention.

Logan Lyles [0:31:26]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:31:26]: Three things are gonna happen from here.

Logan Lyles [0:31:28]: One, you're gonna do nothing with it.

Logan Lyles [0:31:30]: I hope that's not you.

Logan Lyles [0:31:32]: Statistics show that that's gonna be most of you unfortunately, but I hope that's not you.

Logan Lyles [0:31:36]: Number two, you're gonna do it yourself.

Logan Lyles [0:31:38]: Great.

Logan Lyles [0:31:38]: Here's another resource to implement what you…

Logan Lyles [0:31:41]: And keep giving.

Logan Lyles [0:31:42]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:31:42]: Third, you're gonna realize you don't have the the time, the bandwidth, the resources, the expertise to do all this yourself, and kind of that third option that's always left to us is get some help for someone to do it for you or a tool that can help you do it.

Logan Lyles [0:31:55]: So it's not so do it yourself.

Logan Lyles [0:31:57]: And so by framing it that way, taking the next step with your brand isn't a pitch.

Logan Lyles [0:32:01]: It's just a, hey, here are three options, which beth do you wanna choose, choose your own adventure, if you will.

Logan Lyles [0:32:07]: So that has worked well for me and I think that applies.

Logan Lyles [0:32:09]: To any sort of offer whether you've got a service, a solution, low ticket item, high ticket item.

Logan Lyles [0:32:15]: And then I would say the the last point on this, I can share my screen again if this is helpful is how you present the offer during the webinar.

Logan Lyles [0:32:22]: So I've got an example from a webinar.

Logan Lyles [0:32:25]: We actually just ran yesterday for our client Bla, who is a really great tool that helps B2B marketing teams get their whole team active on Linkedin.

Logan Lyles [0:32:36]: And so obviously, they want people who are interested in, you know, their own Linkedin performance as well as that of their team?

Logan Lyles [0:32:45]: Maybe their CEO?

Logan Lyles [0:32:46]: Like, how is my CEO doing?

Logan Lyles [0:32:47]: How do they compare to others in our.

Logan Lyles [0:32:49]: So instead of waiting until after the q and a.

Logan Lyles [0:32:53]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:32:54]: To kinda sneak in that, hey, if you guys want, you could book a demo.

Logan Lyles [0:32:58]: Like, maybe there's a link in the chat or just go to our website.

Logan Lyles [0:33:00]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:33:01]: We…

Logan Lyles [0:33:01]: Sometimes we don't even do that.

Logan Lyles [0:33:02]: We don't even give them a link to freaking click.

Logan Lyles [0:33:04]: So the first thing you can do is make sure you move your offer up upfront before the q and a.

Logan Lyles [0:33:10]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:33:10]: It allows for that natural break that I was just talking about to give them those three options.

Logan Lyles [0:33:14]: And you say, hey, if you're choosing option three.

Logan Lyles [0:33:16]: We've got something for you.

Logan Lyles [0:33:17]: So what we did was we said, Hey, you can get your free personal Linkedin report card.

Logan Lyles [0:33:22]: It's gonna analyze your last twelve months your post history.

Logan Lyles [0:33:25]: It's gonna benchmark you against your peers and competitors.

Logan Lyles [0:33:27]: And, you know, if you book this call, you get your report card, we'll show you the results you will get a a chance to see how the Blaze app can help accelerate what you wanna do on Linkedin across your team and your executives and whatever your thought leadership motion is.

Logan Lyles [0:33:41]: So instead of saying, hey, maybe book a demo, we tied it to something concrete, It's a lead magnet that has a name.

Logan Lyles [0:33:48]: There's a reason for the call.

Logan Lyles [0:33:49]: Like, we're gonna review your results and talk about how Basil can help accelerate them.

Logan Lyles [0:33:54]: And if you'll notice, there's a big old Qr button, or or excuse me, Qr code on screen that people can scan or they can click the link in chat.

Logan Lyles [0:34:03]: And so by doing a few of these tweaks, which again, none of its total rocket science, like, I'm not blowing anybody's minds here, but if you're asking yourself, have I checked all these boxes with how my Cta lands on my webinars?

Logan Lyles [0:34:14]: You're probably missing at least a a few of them.

Logan Lyles [0:34:17]: So I thought that was hopefully some good show and tell for those that are viewing and not watching or viewing and not listening, I should say.

Dasha [0:34:23]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:34:23]: That was awesome.

Dasha [0:34:24]: Caitlin went…

Dasha [0:34:25]: Came on our live show last week, and ran Dave and I, Linkedin profiles through that free pool.

Dasha [0:34:32]: So it's all it's all coming full circle.

Logan Lyles [0:34:34]: Oh, nice.

Logan Lyles [0:34:34]: Nice.

Dasha [0:34:35]: I love the free offer idea.

Logan Lyles [0:34:37]: Shout out to Caitlyn at at Bla.

Logan Lyles [0:34:39]: I think she was a guest.

Logan Lyles [0:34:40]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:34:40]: She was a guest on the Live show.

Logan Lyles [0:34:42]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:34:42]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:34:42]: Yeah awesome.

Logan Lyles [0:34:43]: I love it.

Dasha [0:34:44]: Cool.

Dasha [0:34:44]: And how many people can you expect to take action on the offer?

Dasha [0:34:48]: Do you have any stats on that?

Logan Lyles [0:34:50]: You know, that's a good question.

Logan Lyles [0:34:51]: Well, I haven't broken it down from specifically, like, how many attendees you have live and how many convert typically on the live show?

Logan Lyles [0:34:59]: What I have seen is that if you're doing both of these, you're doing that two step sign up flow and getting rid of the dead end upon sign up, and you're doing a live offer like this kind of an optimized Cta, most of the webinars that we're running for our clients.

Logan Lyles [0:35:15]: If you look at the total number of regis, it's usually between eight and twelve percent of people that are taking that next step.

Logan Lyles [0:35:23]: So think if I got two hundred people registered for the webinar, I should maybe see about twenty people book a demo.

Logan Lyles [0:35:30]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:35:31]: Which is about five times the industry average, because of the two hundred and fifty B2B marketers that we surveyed this year, they…

Logan Lyles [0:35:39]: Like I said, they either don't know their conversion rate or they're hovering around two percent if they do know what that is.

Logan Lyles [0:35:45]: So that's been pretty steady over the last sixteen months.

Dasha [0:35:48]: One question for you slash something I hope you're gonna say.

Dasha [0:35:51]: Does any of this work if you show up to a webinar, and the Ai…

Dasha [0:35:56]: The webinar content itself is just s.

Dasha [0:35:58]: If you apply, we're gonna talk about five mistakes, we're gonna get to the last two, but does this work if your webinar content is garbage?

Logan Lyles [0:36:06]: I mean, it might work in the short term.

Logan Lyles [0:36:08]: Like, you might catch people with, like, hey, here's a here's a topic, you take them through the survey.

Logan Lyles [0:36:12]: They book a call.

Logan Lyles [0:36:13]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:36:13]: Then it's kind of on the quality of your sales process and your product.

Logan Lyles [0:36:16]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:36:16]: But one, if they show up, and they don't even get forty five minutes in because they're dropping off because the content sucks they're not even gonna get to it.

Logan Lyles [0:36:25]: And two, you're gonna burn so many bridges that even the folks that maybe do convert, you know, that book that call, and then they do go to the webinar after the call It's like, no.

Logan Lyles [0:36:35]: I don't even wanna deal with this company.

Logan Lyles [0:36:36]: So I would say, you know, mistake number three is not having a clear Cta in your live show, but three a is having a really crappy live show.

Logan Lyles [0:36:44]: So I almost like that goes without saying, but I'm glad that you bring that up because none of this works if it's all just kind of bait and switch marketing.

Dasha [0:36:52]: Totally.

Dasha [0:36:52]: I totally led you with that question, but I just want someone listening.

Dasha [0:36:55]: Like, I think often as marketers we look for the next tactic.

Dasha [0:36:59]: The next thing that we can do, and this is all great, but I think the thing that doesn't change about marketing at all is you just have to have a good product.

Dasha [0:37:07]: And if you think of your webinar or your live show as a product, you have to have a compelling product to show people, and you cannot fast track your way there even if you have a two step sign up flow, or a Qr code, you show at the end, Like, you have to think about the content too.

Dasha [0:37:22]: And so if you're listening to this, start with compelling content that's actually ent, especially in the age of A s.

Dasha [0:37:28]: It's my little soap box moment.

Logan Lyles [0:37:31]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:37:31]: And the encouraging thing is, like, I bet gosh there are a lot of these B2B marketers that are like you and I that have maybe be driven into that ditch of just educating, doing great content and not seeing the conversions.

Logan Lyles [0:37:43]: I actually…

Logan Lyles [0:37:43]: Like I named it.

Logan Lyles [0:37:44]: I called it the conversion cliff.

Logan Lyles [0:37:46]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:37:46]: Like, you're getting webinar signup ups because your content great, you've built a brand.

Logan Lyles [0:37:50]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:37:50]: People are listening to the podcast version too, but you're hitting this cliff of where it's just falling off.

Logan Lyles [0:37:55]: And so if you have that base, but you're feeling that conversion cliff.

Logan Lyles [0:37:58]: That's really where, again, just a few of these small tweaks throughout your webinar playbook can really make a big difference.

Dasha [0:38:06]: Does this work for, let's say you're running a webinar that it's not geared towards prospects, but it's geared towards your existing customers.

Dasha [0:38:13]: And maybe you're trying to, like, land and expand.

Dasha [0:38:15]: Have you run land and expand strategies with clients.

Dasha [0:38:18]: I'm just thinking selfish officially.

Dasha [0:38:19]: We've got a webinar coming up geared towards our customers.

Dasha [0:38:21]: Should we be doing some of this stuff?

Logan Lyles [0:38:24]: I absolutely think so.

Logan Lyles [0:38:25]: So we're gonna do just some live on the fly consulting, I guess here because In answer to your first question, I haven't run this, and I can't I don't have metrics to tell you, Dash.

Logan Lyles [0:38:34]: This is what you should expect.

Logan Lyles [0:38:35]: We ran this land and expand campaign like I did with kind of those others with this blazer.

Logan Lyles [0:38:39]: However, I think it's it's very, very similar.

Logan Lyles [0:38:42]: If you're thinking about the content in one of those two ways.

Logan Lyles [0:38:45]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:38:45]: The content educate them on this other problem that you solve, which is maybe solved by upgrading to a higher to your plan with more features we're adding on another piece to your platform that they don't have now.

Logan Lyles [0:38:57]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:38:57]: I would frame it the same way.

Logan Lyles [0:38:59]: So think about that current customer base, what other problems can you solve for them and show them educate them on solving it themselves, but give them the option to get some help.

Logan Lyles [0:39:10]: Frame the survey questions similarly.

Logan Lyles [0:39:12]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:39:13]: You might not need to ask some basic things that you already know about them size of company and those sorts of things.

Logan Lyles [0:39:18]: So in those five to six questions you have in your survey, if you do a two step sign up flow like we recommend you have…

Logan Lyles [0:39:25]: Have even more room to kinda do some, like, pain agitation, qualification questions because I've had people who've booked calls after going through these sorts of surveys, which, by the way, you can do behind any lead magnet.

Logan Lyles [0:39:36]: I've done them behind research surveys have done them behind ebooks bugs have done them behind other templates.

Logan Lyles [0:39:41]: Once you realize and get this honed in for webinars, it's like, oh, this is pretty cool.

Logan Lyles [0:39:46]: We can do this behind lots of lead magnets.

Logan Lyles [0:39:47]: But that aside, you have more room to ask some of those questions to kinda lead them?

Logan Lyles [0:39:53]: Because I've had people say, like, well, you ask me, like, three questions about, like, do I know this?

Logan Lyles [0:39:57]: How am I performing here?

Logan Lyles [0:39:59]: How confident am I in this?

Logan Lyles [0:40:00]: And then you offer me book a call to learn a framework to help with this or learn more about a product that Solves x Y and See I was, like, I was primed and ready to go.

Logan Lyles [0:40:08]: So I think the same holds true for land and expand.

Logan Lyles [0:40:11]: So hopefully that's helpful in, like, three minutes of off the cuff advice.

Dasha [0:40:16]: I appreciate the live consulting.

Dasha [0:40:17]: We did not.

Dasha [0:40:18]: I did not prep logan for this.

Dasha [0:40:20]: But this is the benefit of podcasting.

Dasha [0:40:22]: I got free consulting.

Logan Lyles [0:40:23]: I've said that so many times a podcast so Right there with you.

Dasha [0:40:26]: Okay.

Dasha [0:40:26]: Mistake number four.

Logan Lyles [0:40:28]: Mistake number four is only splitting your follow up into attended versus non attendant.

Logan Lyles [0:40:32]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:40:33]: And while that is a signal, I'm a big fan of using the survey data that you've collected, which we talked about earlier, ninety percent of the people who are signing up for your webinar complete the survey.

Logan Lyles [0:40:45]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:40:46]: About ten percent of people are taking that next action right away.

Logan Lyles [0:40:51]: So that means there's a good chunk of people who have given you more first party data, but they haven't taken an action yet.

Logan Lyles [0:40:57]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:40:58]: And so what can you do with that to personalize and prioritize your follow ups.

Logan Lyles [0:41:03]: So if you're a marketing leader and you're running webinars, and one of your frustrations, no one's live, but hopefully, some of you are gonna relate to this.

Logan Lyles [0:41:13]: You hand off a bunch of leads to sales, and not a whole lot of follow up happens.

Logan Lyles [0:41:18]: Well, one thing you could do on our end, maybe there is the fault of of sales, And I've lived on both sides of the fence sales and marketing.

Logan Lyles [0:41:25]: So I feel like I can speak to both.

Logan Lyles [0:41:26]: What if Dash?

Logan Lyles [0:41:27]: Your next webinar, you handed not only first name last name email, but you said, hey, here's everybody who registered.

Logan Lyles [0:41:33]: Here's the ones that attended.

Logan Lyles [0:41:35]: Also, here are the survey answers that they filled out.

Logan Lyles [0:41:38]: Here are the poll questions that they answered stack rank them by these criteria, maybe you do that for them, and you say, hey, out of these two hundred here are the twenty five that really you should go after with this messaging.

Logan Lyles [0:41:49]: Here's the next group of fifty, you should go after with that messaging.

Logan Lyles [0:41:52]: And so not only surveys, we didn't even really touch on polls and data you can get from your live audience, but that's kind of similar to the survey.

Logan Lyles [0:42:01]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:42:01]: Ask multiple choice questions that kind of lead people and segment them by them raising their own hand, you can use both of those to do much more segmented follow, whether you're a team that's relying more on nurture, drip campaigns or you're handing off those leads to sales.

Dasha [0:42:17]: I love that.

Dasha [0:42:18]: Something that we do that's worked really well.

Dasha [0:42:20]: I mean, two things.

Dasha [0:42:21]: One, I have Bd reporting into marketing.

Dasha [0:42:23]: So the…

Dasha [0:42:25]: It doesn't…

Dasha [0:42:26]: We don't kick things over the fence to sales.

Dasha [0:42:28]: We have Bd follow ups and because they report marketing.

Dasha [0:42:31]: It's literally their job to go do that.

Dasha [0:42:33]: So a little bit more follow through there.

Dasha [0:42:35]: But the other thing is if you have your webinar platform or whatever you're using, hook up to Hubspot, you can actually create a segment for them, and you can have, like, high priority leads medium priority and feed them the information in the system where they already live for us that's Hubspot.

Dasha [0:42:53]: The B2B yours are already hanging out there.

Dasha [0:42:55]: They can see, like, all of the enriched data for that account as well if it existed, Do we have prior relationship with them?

Dasha [0:43:01]: That way they can say, hey, John.

Dasha [0:43:03]: I saw you attended the webinar.

Dasha [0:43:05]: Also, we tried to sell to you in, like, twenty eighteen, and at the time it wasn't the right time because you were doing x y z.

Dasha [0:43:10]: So it allows them to have this, like, really personalized outreach?

Dasha [0:43:13]: But, yeah, I guess, my advice is, like, if you're able to get all this data into a system where your team already hangs out and make it just, like, so easy.

Dasha [0:43:20]: We call it, like, a low friction ask.

Dasha [0:43:22]: I think low friction asks are great no matter what you're doing, but for sales and people who are busy in general.

Dasha [0:43:28]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:43:28]: The lower friction you can make it the better.

Logan Lyles [0:43:31]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:43:31]: I love it.

Dasha [0:43:32]: Alright.

Dasha [0:43:32]: Round this out.

Dasha [0:43:33]: What is mistake?

Dasha [0:43:34]: Number five.

Logan Lyles [0:43:35]: Mistake number five, letting the webinar end when the webinar ends.

Logan Lyles [0:43:38]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:43:38]: To me, that is just the beginning of the content process.

Logan Lyles [0:43:42]: You've done so much to put together this content that just letting it die on the shelf is, like, T of justice really.

Logan Lyles [0:43:51]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:43:51]: And so I think the the first thing that we typically do is we'd actually moved our webinars onto Riverside because I I love the quality that you get from Riverside, just like in podcasting like this.

Logan Lyles [0:44:03]: You get separate high quality tracks there makes clipping a lot easier plus, you know, higher quality video.

Logan Lyles [0:44:10]: But that's really just the start.

Logan Lyles [0:44:12]: Like, I've seen Exit Five and do this really, really well.

Logan Lyles [0:44:15]: You mentioned it earlier, Maria, Marissa and the the team doing a great job of this.

Logan Lyles [0:44:19]: You know, sometimes people want that content, but they don't want it in that live format.

Logan Lyles [0:44:24]: So don't just make your emails just promoting the next webinar, break breakdown that forty five minute to an hour conversation into a full breakdown, into a newsletter that is just standalone valuable content.

Logan Lyles [0:44:37]: Obviously, you can do that with Linkedin post with blog content as well.

Logan Lyles [0:44:41]: But I think oftentimes like blogs and video clips are where people start with webinar repurposing, and I think one of the lowest hanging fruit is looking at your highest performing webinar, and can that be turned into another sort of lead magnet for another sort of learner.

Logan Lyles [0:44:55]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:44:56]: Some of us are visual learners, some of us are auditory some are kin aesthetic, that sort.

Logan Lyles [0:45:00]: And you've got all sorts in your audience no matter what your Ic is, So can you turn that into a lead magnet that's a template or some sort of interactive lead magnet?

Logan Lyles [0:45:10]: I saw some data from Neil Patel recently that was, like, interactive lead magnets, which are way easier for us to produce now that Vibe coating is such a thing.

Logan Lyles [0:45:18]: Feeding that transcript into quad and working out some sort of interactive kind of step by step thing.

Logan Lyles [0:45:25]: I think is kind of low hanging fruit that if you're doing nothing else to repurpose your are webinar content, maybe actually start there because then you've got a new lead magnet.

Logan Lyles [0:45:35]: Maybe that's feeding your paid social campaigns because your current direct Cta isn't really producing.

Logan Lyles [0:45:40]: You need something that's more middle of the funnel, something like that.

Logan Lyles [0:45:43]: So I think there are just a a few piece of low hanging fruit than a lot of us are just walking past day after day with repurposing webinars.

Dasha [0:45:51]: I think that's a great segue to probably one of my last question, which is what parts of this can you use Ai for.

Dasha [0:45:57]: Like, when you say repurpose my head goes.

Dasha [0:45:59]: Okay.

Dasha [0:45:59]: Ai.

Dasha [0:46:00]: I can help me with that.

Dasha [0:46:01]: What have you been using Ai for for your clients?

Dasha [0:46:04]: And what is your overall workflow you're open to sharing.

Logan Lyles [0:46:08]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:46:08]: So this is something that changed here recently for me, you know, after running nearly a hundred webinars, Right?

Logan Lyles [0:46:15]: I have a process down.

Logan Lyles [0:46:17]: I know what my checklist is, I've obviously refined some prompts.

Logan Lyles [0:46:21]: I've refined those prompts with, like, hey, with title writing.

Logan Lyles [0:46:25]: Actually analyzed a bunch of content from Youtube strategist.

Logan Lyles [0:46:29]: About writing really good titles for Youtube.

Logan Lyles [0:46:32]: Right?

Logan Lyles [0:46:33]: Pulled out the best of that and bake that into my webinar planning prompt because I think oftentimes webinar titles just really suck.

Logan Lyles [0:46:40]: We don't put any time or effort or energy into them.

Logan Lyles [0:46:43]: And so even though, like, things like that were going well in this prompt, I was still kind of one shot it.

Logan Lyles [0:46:49]: Like, I had a really good prompt, but it was giving me the title, what's gonna be the Url slug, the landing page copy, the email copy, and the second email copy, and the Linkedin post, those sorts of things.

Logan Lyles [0:46:58]: But when you're planning a webinar or any sort of campaign, like, you're usually starting from the top, and then things are gonna flow downhill.

Logan Lyles [0:47:05]: For instance, like, once you have the title, that's gonna help you write better landing page copy.

Logan Lyles [0:47:10]: And once you have kind of those, like, what you're gonna get bullets, on the landing page and you've really thought about those and hone them in, that should carry over to your emails to your post, those sorts of things, you shouldn't be reinventing the wheel.

Logan Lyles [0:47:21]: And I found that, like, when I was using Claude to kinda of one shot my webinar plan even it was better than than nothing.

Logan Lyles [0:47:28]: And obviously, I was editing it, I was going through kind of a lot.

Logan Lyles [0:47:32]: And so what I did was actually, I changed that prompt, it's gonna giving me something, like the landing page copy, and then I'm giving it some feedback.

Logan Lyles [0:47:41]: And then I might approve or decline it or I might give it, hey, here's my rewrite based on what you did.

Logan Lyles [0:47:48]: Now lock that into memory and move on to the next asset that you know to do, like, the SEO description.

Logan Lyles [0:47:54]: And also give me a few options.

Logan Lyles [0:47:56]: Alright.

Logan Lyles [0:47:57]: Let's use this version.

Logan Lyles [0:47:58]: Let's…

Logan Lyles [0:47:58]: And so just by doing that by changing my prompt instead of really well trained, prompt to kinda give me everything.

Logan Lyles [0:48:06]: Give me one thing in a time and then output all that.

Logan Lyles [0:48:09]: To one markdown file that's easily gonna go into Google Drive and now I can use that.

Logan Lyles [0:48:13]: My next steps are, like, automating more of that of, like, once that goes here, and I've worked with Quad to just one shot at.

Logan Lyles [0:48:20]: How do I automate some of those next steps which I'm behind some of my peers there with kind of taking agents and and c and quad code to, kind of some of those next steps.

Logan Lyles [0:48:31]: But to me, it's kind of repeating some of those repeatable things putting the human in the loop as we're all kind of maybe tired of hearing these days, but it's really important in changing that up, made a difference for me.

Dasha [0:48:45]: When I was little, all I wanted to do when I grew up is to be a human in a loop.

Dasha [0:48:48]: So so happy it happened for me.

Dasha [0:48:51]: Oh,

Logan Lyles [0:48:54]: that's good.

Dasha [0:48:55]: Okay.

Dasha [0:48:55]: I mean, yes.

Dasha [0:48:56]: I think in general, what I found with Ai is…

Dasha [0:48:59]: The way I explained it to my team, we recently had this initiative, like, get everyone at the company, Quote unquote Ai pill, even think of Ais is having, like, a hundred percent brain calories or, like a hundred points.

Dasha [0:49:10]: And you can choose to put those one hundred points towards, like, twenty different things.

Dasha [0:49:14]: Like, let's say there's, like, a a webinar or checklist that has twenty steps.

Dasha [0:49:18]: Writing the title all writing the slug, writing the description, you can spend a hundred tokens on, like, all of those things at once, and you're gonna get a little bit of effort across all of them, or you can do one task at a time and every single task gets a hundred.

Dasha [0:49:32]: Little brain calorie points, which is obviously gonna produce way better results.

Dasha [0:49:37]: Right?

Dasha [0:49:37]: If I I want someone that's just thinking about the title.

Dasha [0:49:40]: I want someone that's just thinking about the description.

Dasha [0:49:42]: So, yeah.

Dasha [0:49:43]: I love the no one shot from.

Logan Lyles [0:49:46]: It's also a really good point.

Logan Lyles [0:49:46]: I actually learned this from, Caitlyn Bla that we were mentioning earlier in our webinar we did yesterday.

Logan Lyles [0:49:52]: She was talking about how their app helps you write content in your voice, And one of the things she's learned from their engineering team is you want a different agent to judge the quality of another agent's output.

Logan Lyles [0:50:03]: And, like, the quickest way to do that is maybe even if you're just on chat And claude and going back and forth because they're not going to do a good job of kind of grading their own output And so it just kinda follows that kind of quote unquote best practice with Ai that I didn't even realize until, you know, someone smarter than me educated me a little bit this week.

Dasha [0:50:23]: Totally.

Dasha [0:50:23]: You can set up loops too.

Dasha [0:50:25]: Something that we've done is Like, let's say you know that three personas are gonna attend your webinar.

Dasha [0:50:30]: Once you have your final markdown, you share it with Ai and you say create a loop, I want it to be reviewed by, let's say you've got the VP of sales and then the VP of It and then the CMO and give me feedback is all three.

Dasha [0:50:42]: And that way, you have, like, three…

Dasha [0:50:44]: A a loop where it's gonna keep optimizing it until all three of your critics getting back with amazing feedback.

Logan Lyles [0:50:50]: I like that.

Dasha [0:50:51]: Super fun.

Dasha [0:50:52]: You get to, like, create the synthetic committee that's evaluating your work.

Dasha [0:50:55]: Alright.

Dasha [0:50:56]: Logan.

Dasha [0:50:56]: Thank you so much for for coming on the show.

Dasha [0:50:58]: This was awesome.

Dasha [0:50:59]: I love Guests like you who come prepared with so much like, rich tactic.

Dasha [0:51:03]: Like, I feel like I don't even know how this is gonna get rep repo into a newsletter because I feel you gave us so much short of thank you for being generous.

Logan Lyles [0:51:11]: It'll be a long newsletter, hopefully.

Dasha [0:51:12]: Yeah.

Dasha [0:51:12]: It's gonna be a long, long newsletter.

Dasha [0:51:14]: Where can people find you?

Logan Lyles [0:51:16]: Yeah.

Logan Lyles [0:51:16]: So I would say three things from here.

Logan Lyles [0:51:18]: If you wanna connect with me on Linkedin.

Logan Lyles [0:51:19]: I'm really easy to find Logan Lyles last name is why elias e s really easy to to find there.

Logan Lyles [0:51:24]: If you wanna learn more about what we do and how we can help your webinar program, go to DemandShift dot c.

Logan Lyles [0:51:29]: But that's probably not gonna be most of you.

Logan Lyles [0:51:31]: So I became prepared.

Logan Lyles [0:51:32]: If you go to DemandShift dot c slash report I mentioned way back at the beginning in the episode, we surveyed over two hundred and fifty B2B marketers around all sorts of areas like, how many webinar regis strengths do you get?

Logan Lyles [0:51:45]: What tactics are working for you.

Logan Lyles [0:51:47]: What's your conversion rate to book sales call These sorts of metrics that a lot of people aren't sharing publicly, and we're sharing a report from all of that data here soon, and you can join the wait list.

Logan Lyles [0:51:58]: So go to DemandShift dot c slash report if you wanna dive deeper into some webinar specific data for B2B teams like yours

Dasha [0:52:05]: You did the thing you walked the walk.

Dasha [0:52:07]: Wanna talk.

Logan Lyles [0:52:09]: I tried to, you know, drink my own champagne, eat your own dog food, like, in none of those ever really encapsulate, but try to do the thing that you're teaching on.

Logan Lyles [0:52:17]: So Hopefully that resonates with everybody.

Dasha [0:52:20]: I love it.

Dasha [0:52:20]: Thank you so much for coming on the pod.

Dasha [0:52:22]: That's the show.

Logan Lyles [0:52:24]: Thanks for having me.

Dasha [0:52:28]: Hey.

Dasha [0:52:28]: Thanks for listening to this podcast.

Dasha [0:52:30]: If you like this episode.

Dasha [0:52:31]: Do you know what?

Dasha [0:52:32]: I'm not even gonna ask you to subscribe and leave a review because I don't really care about that.

Dasha [0:52:36]: I have something better for you.

Dasha [0:52:37]: So we've built the number one private community for B2B marketers at Exit Five, and you can go and check that out instead of leaving a rating or review, go check it out right now.

Dasha [0:52:47]: On our website exitfive.com.

Dasha [0:52:49]: Our mission at Exit Five is to help you grow your career in Bb marketing, and there's no better place to do that than with us at Exit Five.

Dasha [0:52:56]: There's nearly five thousand members now in our community.

Dasha [0:52:59]: People are in there posting every day asking questions about things like marketing planning, ideas, inspiration, asking questions and getting feedback from your peers, building your own network of marketers who are doing the same thing you are so you can have a peer group, or maybe just venting about your boss when you need to get in there and get something off your chest.

Dasha [0:53:17]: It's a hundred percent free to join for seven days so you can go and check it out risk free, and then there's a small annual fee to pay if you wanna become a member for the year.

Dasha [0:53:26]: Go check it out, learn more, exitfive.com, and I will see you over there in the community.